Erik ten Hag named new United manager

Justin Cider said:
Calm yourself, it's just a weird thing for a United fan to say(twice) in the company of other United fans, that's all. It comes across as if you feel sorry for Liverpool ....

You're in Aldi, there are two women scrapping over the £4 Air Fryer in the middle isle, a third women comes from nowhere knocks the first two women out of the way and nabs herself the Air Fryer, that's wanting it more ....
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It really isn't given we were talking about fitness of the players generally, I felt in extra time we had the physical edge because we hadn't played a midweek match. No sympathy for them if you want to win trophies you need to be able to win these matches in the stages of the season where you have to dig deep and get over the line.

That's what separates the good teams in history from the great ones. The great ones dig in and find a way to get the winner, a good team doesn't.

I'd say women number 3 hasn't wanted it more at all. She's used her experience allowed women number 1 & 2 to ware each other down then stepped in to beat two worn down opponents to the prize. The prize will either give her food poisoning from eating whatever it produces or potentially burns down her house through an electrical fault. You'd never get such cheap tat in Lidl!
 
jsp said:
It really isn't given we were talking about fitness of the players generally, I felt in extra time we had the physical edge because we hadn't played a midweek match. No sympathy for them if you want to win trophies you need to be able to win these matches in the stages of the season where you have to dig deep and get over the line.
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Players want to play Saturday, Wednesday then Saturday ....

And in this instance how many of the Liverpool players from extra-time onwards had been playing S. W then S recently, I'd hazard a guess very few, and not sure how you can say we had the physical edge, Garnacho went into the game injured and if he'd been a horse he would've been put down, McTominay cramped up badly around the 75th minute mark and somehow kept going, and Bruno limping around in defence late on could hardly move - if I was Klopp I'd want to know why his team who were sure they had the game won at 2-3 couldn't win when they were basically playing against 8 men!
 
Of course they want to but when you are doing it week after week it takes its toll on you.

They’ve played 18 games in 2024 we’ve played 12.

If I was Klopp I’d probably be thinking was sending on 3 youngsters in a winning position a smart move. Probably not but that’s what he had on the bench and like Ten Hag he knew he had players that weren’t going to last 90 minutes let alone 120.

It was basically this exact point last season where our great run of form ended we totally ran out of steam just after landing the league cup and let’s hope they do the same.
 
jsp said:
Of course they want to but when you are doing it week after week it takes its toll on you.

They’ve played 18 games in 2024 we’ve played 12.

If I was Klopp I’d probably be thinking was sending on 3 youngsters in a winning position a smart move. Probably not but that’s what he had on the bench and like Ten Hag he knew he had players that weren’t going to last 90 minutes let alone 120.

It was basically this exact point last season where our great run of form ended we totally ran out of steam just after landing the league cup and let’s hope they do the same.
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It's almost like you don't know you are doing it, stop making excuses for a team that will always be our biggest rivals.

Kidz 2day, my God!
 
Cmon chaps if you watch the match again ( after the live one was over) you will see that in the final ten or 15 mins we knew that we were losing and something had to be done. At that stage when you are winning the match the energy level drops off and that is what happened to Liverpool. After Rashford equalized we can see that only two players went to him to celebrate. The rest just walked back. It is just the adrenaline that kept us going.
 
Justin Cider said:
It's almost like you don't know you are doing it, stop making excuses for a team that will always be our biggest rivals.

Kidz 2day, my God!
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It's almost like you've got no interest in having a sensible conversation about this once the emotion and buzz of that game has worn off and try and look at what actually happened.

Yep lets go back to age again, how old do you think I am?

Always nice to be called a kid
 
JC can never a see a problem with Man Utd. It's admirable, but does mean you cannot have proper conversation re: the club.

That game was the best time united had given me in years.

But there was a spell in that game I was swearing at the TV about how easy were to play through. Another day, a less tired Liverpool, that game would have been killed off. From their 1st, to our 2nd, largely, we were awful.

Great feeling, but that performance cannot paper over the huge cracks in this team
 
Mr C said:
But there was a spell in that game I was swearing at the TV about how easy were to play through. Another day, a less tired Liverpool, that game would have been killed off. From their 1st, to our 2nd, largely, we were awful.
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I give United so much credit for the way that they hung in there and battled. That’s not a trait they’ve shown an awful lot this year. In fact when Liverpool went 2-1 up right before halftime I said to my Mrs that United would probably lose 3, 4, 5-1. They stuck in there though and when given a chance they took it. In fact they did that more than once.
 
Yeah, from when we scored our second, I thought we'd win, even when they scored their 3rd.

But like I say, inbetween their 1st and our 2nd, it was a tough watch
 
Mr C said:
Yeah, from when we scored our second, I thought we'd win, even when they scored their 3rd.

But like I say, inbetween their 1st and our 2nd, it was a tough watch
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Yeah that’s fair. I actually missed some of the second half as I was taking my eldest home but listened on the radio and at one point I think Liverpool were threatening to put the game away. But they didn’t and United hung on in there and got a great result.
 
I don't think it papers over anything but it shows we can go toe to toe with a good side and come out on top.

Was a real roller coaster match for the first half hour we were flying really should have gone 2-0 up with that McTominay chance but after that it felt like we'd lost it but the moment we equalised which came out of nowhere you felt the game was ours to lose.

More interesting will be how they perform away to Brentford. That game last season was an embarrassing performance they should be going out looking for revenge and making sure the effort levels we saw against Liverpool are matched again by everyone.
 
jsp said:
It's almost like you've got no interest in having a sensible conversation about this once the emotion and buzz of that game has worn off and try and look at what actually happened.

Yep lets go back to age again, how old do you think I am?

Always nice to be called a kid
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Simple question for you, hope it doesn't upset you too much, do you think if Liverpool had played the same amount of games as United, had more experienced players to bring on at 2-3 if United could still have won?

Probable late 30's, maybe even early 40's, trust me compared to me that still a kid
 
Mr C said:
JC can never a see a problem with Man Utd. It's admirable, but does mean you cannot have proper conversation re: the club.

That game was the best time united had given me in years.

But there was a spell in that game I was swearing at the TV about how easy were to play through. Another day, a less tired Liverpool, that game would have been killed off. From their 1st, to our 2nd, largely, we were awful.

Great feeling, but that performance cannot paper over the huge cracks in this team
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Well pardon me for supporting the club, mental note to self, must look at reasons, cos there must be reasons why United ever win a match to blend in with the crowd ....

Why Liverpool being tired or not even comes into your thinking is totally beyond me, do you really think if the the shoe was on the other foot Liverpool fans on RAWK would be saying we were lucky United were tired in extra-time, would they feck as like ...

There are so many United fans online who are so reluctant to give the team they say they support any credit whatsoever, it's just weird, like when we've finished 2nd or 3rd in the League, it's always yeah but we only finished that high because Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs and Accrington fecking Stanley had terrible luck with injuries, that's fine, but when United miss out on T4 because of injuries it's these things happen, and we should be able to cope with it .... .....

It's tiring.
 
Justin Cider said:
Simple question for you, hope it doesn't upset you too much, do you think if Liverpool had played the same amount of games as United, had more experienced players to bring on at 2-3 if United could still have won?

Probable late 30's, maybe even early 40's, trust me compared to me that still a kid
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Of course we could still win its football mad things can happen that turn games quickly. Their goal in extra time I felt was against the run of play, I felt in extra time we had the momentum they weren’t able to regroup and dictate the game the way they had for a lot of the second half. I think that was because physically they’d gone they didn’t have the energy to push us back and pen us in.

If the above hypothetical was true I think they’d probably would have got the third at 1-2 when they were in control and killed us off. Their subs in the 90 minutes I think made them a bit more vulnerable and Utd got a break with the Antony goal and got back in it.
 
jsp said:
Of course we could still win its football mad things can happen that turn games quickly. Their goal in extra time I felt was against the run of play, I felt in extra time we had the momentum they weren’t able to regroup and dictate the game the way they had for a lot of the second half. I think that was because physically they’d gone they didn’t have the energy to push us back and pen us in.

If the above hypothetical was true I think they’d probably would have got the third at 1-2 when they were in control and killed us off. Their subs in the 90 minutes I think made them a bit more vulnerable and Utd got a break with the Antony goal and got back in it.
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Not sure EtH would have had us set-up the same if that was the case though. Bruno at CB, Antony at FB with Kambwala and Amrabat still on the bench?? no me neither ....

It's funny, so many are critical of the large gaps we leave in midfield which is obviously by design and a work in progress, and not some shocking coaching oversight, and it was that area where EtH outfoxed Klopp in extra-time by putting our substitutes on fresh to make the best use of that space.

It's high risk, hopefully in the near future high reward.
 
Justin Cider said:
Not sure EtH would have had us set-up the same if that was the case though. Bruno at CB, Antony at FB with Kambwala and Amrabat still on the bench?? no me neither ....

It's funny, so many are critical of the large gaps we leave in midfield which is obviously by design and a work in progress, and not some shocking coaching oversight, and it was that area where EtH outfoxed Klopp in extra-time by putting our substitutes on fresh to make the best use of that space.

It's high risk, hopefully in the near future high reward.
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No it is not by design and you can infer it from his interviews as well. He wanted the defence to push up so there is no gap but they dropped back after the first 30 mins or so and hence the gaps starting to appear. In the last quarter or so he started to go 1 V 1 at the back. The same in the extra time. I am sure that had we got in front earlier on he would have gone defensive.
 
justintime said:
No it is not by design and you can infer it from his interviews as well. He wanted the defence to push up so there is no gap but they dropped back after the first 30 mins or so and hence the gaps starting to appear. In the last quarter or so he started to go 1 V 1 at the back. The same in the extra time. I am sure that had we got in front earlier on he would have gone defensive.
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That would only make sense if it was a one-off game, but it happens every single game, so it must be part of the planning, maybe EtH is not keen to admit it, just yet anyway, and he's happy to let idiots like Jamie friggin Carragher who has never coached in his life tell him how not to set a football team up ...

And by and large it works.
 
Justin Cider said:
That would only make sense if it was a one-off game, but it happens every single game, so it must be part of the planning, maybe EtH is not keen to admit it, just yet anyway, and he's happy to let idiots like Jamie friggin Carragher who has never coached in his life tell him how not to set a football team up ...

And by and large it works.
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No we do not do it every game. We never go 1 v 1 at the back. It is idiotic to let the opposition team control the tempo of the game and midfield. I would say that the defence drops deep because that is what they have used to for a long time. Low block. There is not point in our forwards running like headless chicken and tiring themselves out. I do not think ETH is that stupid.
 
justintime said:
No we do not do it every game. We never go 1 v 1 at the back. It is idiotic to let the opposition team control the tempo of the game and midfield. I would say that the defence drops deep because that is what they have used to for a long time. Low block. There is not point in our forwards running like headless chicken and tiring themselves out. I do not think ETH is that stupid.
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Don't recall saying we ever did, but what we do every single game is leave the midfield areas 'open' to encourage the opposition on to us, very risky against the better teams granted, but against the rest well worth the risk - we defend the width of the pitch then just defend the width of the penalty area as we get deeper which leaves the attacking team two options, take a shot hence the high shot count against us, or go wide and try and get a cross in which should play into our hands if Onana and the two CB's are switched on, or they go back the way passing it into an area of the pitch were our front 4/5 who were pressing high are situated again if they are switched on, and not day-dreaming(and hopefully in an on-side position).

If a couple of 35/40 yarders start flying into the top corner EtH may look at that tactic again but till such time as he has the players/squad he thinks he needs I can't see him changing it, and if it's working(within reason)why change it.
 
If the next 4 results go:

Chelsea 3 Manchester United 0
Manchester United 1 Liverpool 4
Bournemouth 1 Manchester United 2 and
Coventry City 1 Manchester United 0

Does the Axeman get his big chopper out, or does EtH get a stay of execution till the end of the season?
 
Other than losing 9-0 back to back I think the results won't matter and he won't be sacked this season. That's probably the right call as well. Let him finish his season, and then take a look at what happened on the whole.
 
I think if he lost 4 games in a row he'd be sacked and they'd appoint an interim to the end of the season.

Even if he won every game to the end of the season it might not save his job if the new top dogs don't think he's the right guy to take us forward they will need to be ruthless.

I'd expect the minimum the new boys are expecting is Utd to at least finish 6th and reach the cup final.
 
www.bbc.co.uk

Player workloads affecting performances, warns Ten Hag

Manchester United boss Erik ten Hag warns top players' performances are dropping off because they are "overloaded".
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

He isn't wrong but it's easy to just blame international breaks as a club you also need to plan and manage that with the players.

You obviously can't control the number of minutes players play and the travel but I doubt international training is particularly gruelling physically.

I've also smelt a rat with "the training is to hard" complaints that seem to leak out whenever the team is struggling. I imagine the training at Utd is no harder or easier than it is at any other top side with games every 3 days your fitness work isn't going to be that extreme.
 
He's acting like this was all srpung on him last week. It's common knowledge as a manager wanting to win a lot of trophies you will have to come up with a plan to manage your players time on the pitch. It's just that simple. If you choose to push your players to breaking point and have no back up then it's on you. A manager needs to learn all of his players strengths and weaknesses and act accordingly. This is where he seems to have a lot of problems IMO.

I don't take too much from the stories usually, but there has been some truths about us come out quite recently. So maybe training really is too hard.
 
These kind of shambolic endings aren’t going to help ETH’s chances of keeping his job. It’s obviously not all on him but he’ll take the fall for these players like many have before him.

I think he is out regardless of what happens between now and the end of the season, however he is not helped by our players showing naivety time and time again.
 
I have had enough of him. It has shown that he is not a top manager though he got Ajax to play good football and got into the semis of the CL.
 
It's not a great time for ETH, and whilst I think he is on borrowed time, I am more frustrated with the players. We have to see them for what they are, a squad of moderate talent, sprinkled in places with some gold dust, severely lacking in football intelligence.
 
RVN said:
It's not a great time for ETH, and whilst I think he is on borrowed time, I am more frustrated with the players. We have to see them for what they are, a squad of moderate talent, sprinkled in places with some gold dust, severely lacking in football intelligence.
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That I agree with you but as the manager he needs to either get them to play the way he wants them to play or get the youngsters who are willing to play. Also Amrabat may not have a good game either but he needs to give him a chance to show what he can do. You do not become a terrible player after playing so well in a WC third place match. He is one player who can hold the ball fairly well. Also he is and out and out DM and we do not need Cas to do any play making as Mainoo is capable of doing this. How can we lose 4-3 after leading for so late in the game?
SAF later on used to bring Berbatov on late in the game due to his heading ability and his ability to keep possession. All we need was to keep possession.
 
Yes the players are to blame and so is the manager its a collective but you cant sack the players so the usual will probably happen ETH will get the boot, thats for Ineos to decide.

Getting the right manager next time is crucial because its a massive job and will put a lot off, that just might save ETH.
 
The manager hasn't done enough to keep his job.

It's been a really poor season, and he hasn't been able to get 11 players out and play some kind of system. It's all so random.

However some of the names being mentioned are chilling.
 
My thoughts are I am fine getting rid of a manager if they aren’t doing well but you need to replace him with someone who is going to do better.

Some of the names linked I just don’t see as worth it. You may as well keep ETH and keep some continuity going. My choice would be Amorim at Sporting but sounds like he’s coveted by Liverpool and Barca so could be tough to get him.

Again though we need the players to be brought in that work under a managers vision. Amorim’s teams are ultra pressing but our players just don’t have that in them.
 
2 Cup finals last year which is a helluva achievement for any club, potentially one more this season, and two solid if unspectacular League seasons, not sure what more we should expect from somebody tasked with building a base to build from.

Rome wasn't built in a day, mind there were a lot of hills, 7 apparently, similar to Gateshead and Sheffield but nicer weather ....
 
I can't see the new decision makers keeping him they'll want to put their own man in.

I think there's a lot of extenuating circumstances for this mess and fingers of blame will point to a lot of people but SJR seems to be replacing everyone starting at the top and working his way down so feels only a matter of time before it's Ten Hag who's replaced.

Any manager is going to be struggling with this number of injuries you can't plan for anything everything is firefighting just as you put one problem to bed, 10 new ones pop up.
 
Justin Cider said:
2 Cup finals last year which is a helluva achievement for any club, potentially one more this season, and two solid if unspectacular League seasons, not sure what more we should expect from somebody tasked with building a base to build from.

Rome wasn't built in a day, mind there were a lot of hills, 7 apparently, similar to Gateshead and Sheffield but nicer weather ....
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This guy gets it.

Oops
 
We’ve been saying Rome wasn’t built in a day ever since SAF retired! Eventually we need someone who is going to provide a few decent bricks!
 

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