Premier League 2023/24: Man United vs Fulham - Sat 24th Feb - 15:00 KO

Justin Cider said:
Amass and Nolan starting for the 18s in the 12:00 kick-off today, so looks like it will be Habeeb Ogunneye with the first-team squad, and probably just miss out, or he may be injured(he's had more than his fair share), or with the 21s who often play at the same time, but who knows, if Amass or Nolan are subbed off at HT .....




Thanks JC. you sure know your stuff, the forum is lucky to have you ....
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You is the bestest, Justin.
 
Struggling here, trying to remember the last time United chasing a game attacking the Stretford End in the 2nd half equalised late on and then didn't kick on to win, getting beat that just doesn't happen.
 
Slowly going through the game again in my head this morning and I honestly couldn't say who I thought United's best player(on the day) was, more disturbing I can't single out anybody as the worst.
 
From the highlights I'd probably say Onana made some good saves to keep it at 0-0 and I don't think there's much he could have done on either goal.

Sounds like all the outfield players were well below their best.
 
jsp said:
From the highlights I'd probably say Onana made some good saves to keep it at 0-0 and I don't think there's much he could have done on either goal.

Sounds like all the outfield players were well below their best.
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Yeah Onana was solid, as was Dalot, but Dalot went to pot in the last 10 minutes, he had numerous chances to put dangerous crosses into the box but fluffed his lines single every time.

And Garnacho stuck at it, those three I'd give 6/10, the rest 4's and 5's
 
Maguire looked to me our MOTM, but quite some way. He was the only one who looked like he hadn't given up entirely. He was also trying to organise our back line - I watched him shouting at others and also progressing us quite calmly out of defence on occasions.
 
Jayc1860 said:
Maguire looked to me our MOTM, but quite some way. He was the only one who looked like he hadn't given up entirely. He was also trying to organise our back line - I watched him shouting at others and also progressing us quite calmly out of defence on occasions.
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I only saw the highlights but looked a real mixed bag to me from Maguire.

Scored a tap in but missed another easy chance. The header off the corner he should be burying but think it was his good work that kept the attack going that led to the goal.

Could have got a straight red for a late tackle, got roasted by Traore for the 2nd goal, think there was another chance in the first half where he tried to step forward to intercept and got nowhere near winning the ball leaving a big gap behind him.

I personally think he should have just taken the second yellow card for that Traore counter it was so late in the game he just had to stop that counter as Lindelof was out of position and so was he. Sometimes you just have to sacrifice yourself. Gamble that the ref bottles the second yellow card and take one for the team.
 
jsp said:
I only saw the highlights but looked a real mixed bag to me from Maguire.

Scored a tap in but missed another easy chance. The header off the corner he should be burying but think it was his good work that kept the attack going that led to the goal.

Could have got a straight red for a late tackle, got roasted by Traore for the 2nd goal, think there was another chance in the first half where he tried to step forward to intercept and got nowhere near winning the ball leaving a big gap behind him.

I personally think he should have just taken the second yellow card for that Traore counter it was so late in the game he just had to stop that counter as Lindelof was out of position and so was he. Sometimes you just have to sacrifice yourself. Gamble that the ref bottles the second yellow card and take one for the team.
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Yeah, he was far from perfect. The best of a bad bunch is all. Not really saying he deserved more than a rating of 5/6. The rest of the team though were just way worse.

I wouldn't of been against him taking the hit either, resulting in a red. At least we might have scraped a draw.
 
Jayc1860 said:
Yeah, he was far from perfect. The best of a bad bunch is all. Not really saying he deserved more than a rating of 5/6. The rest of the team though were just way worse.

I wouldn't of been against him taking the hit either, resulting in a red. At least we might have scraped a draw.
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I said Onana as from the highlights I saw it was very slim pickings and he at least made a couple of saves to keep the score down.

Think it's just a confidence thing with Maguire he's terrified of doing something wrong and being criticised. Think if you are playing well you just make the foul and accept whatever consequence, hope the ref bottles it in front of the home crowd.

I think it's one of those reds where he gets clapped off down the tunnel as he had no choice.

Oliver loves a decision against Utd the little Geordie tw*t so he probably had his hand in his pocket already when he saw Maguire go near Traore.
 
jsp said:
I said Onana as from the highlights I saw it was very slim pickings and he at least made a couple of saves to keep the score down.

Think it's just a confidence thing with Maguire he's terrified of doing something wrong and being criticised. Think if you are playing well you just make the foul and accept whatever consequence, hope the ref bottles it in front of the home crowd.

I think it's one of those reds where he gets clapped off down the tunnel as he had no choice.

Oliver loves a decision against Utd the little Geordie tw*t so he probably had his hand in his pocket already when he saw Maguire go near Traore.
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Yeah Onana wasn't terrible either I suppose. I'm still not a fan, think that was money wasted.

I think Maguire has grown in confidence recently. Just on this occasion he made the wrong decision. He's certainly becoming a player I want to keep rather than move on in the summer.
 
Jayc1860 said:
Yeah Onana wasn't terrible either I suppose. I'm still not a fan, think that was money wasted.

I think Maguire has grown in confidence recently. Just on this occasion he made the wrong decision. He's certainly becoming a player I want to keep rather than move on in the summer.
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Probably will end up being a waste of money. Feels like we’ve signed a keeper to suit a certain way of playing that we haven’t been able to play because of the injuries. We have also massively overpaid for him off the back of a good season. At that price he should be a lot better than he is but I think he’d also benefit from the team in front of him stopping the Number of shots he faces every week.

I think with Maguire if there’s offers in the summer we should take them. Think a move will do him good with Utd there’s to much negative history I’d like to see us build a new partnership with *fingers crossed* a fit Martinez next season.
 
jsp said:
I only saw the highlights but looked a real mixed bag to me from Maguire.

Scored a tap in but missed another easy chance. The header off the corner he should be burying but think it was his good work that kept the attack going that led to the goal.

Could have got a straight red for a late tackle, got roasted by Traore for the 2nd goal, think there was another chance in the first half where he tried to step forward to intercept and got nowhere near winning the ball leaving a big gap behind him.

I personally think he should have just taken the second yellow card for that Traore counter it was so late in the game he just had to stop that counter as Lindelof was out of position and so was he. Sometimes you just have to sacrifice yourself. Gamble that the ref bottles the second yellow card and take one for the team.
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Traore is going to roast anyone in the United team.
 
jsp said:
Which is why you drag him to the ground before he gets away as once he’s gone there’s no catching him.
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You are correct in that. It is a professional foul situation and 1-1 is better than 1-2 loss. Many times I feel that our players do not have a brain. Not only under ETH but these same players under Ole too.
 
justintime said:
You are correct in that. It is a professional foul situation and 1-1 is better than 1-2 loss. Many times I feel that our players do not have a brain. Not only under ETH but these same players under Ole too.
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Not sure you need to professionally foul a player who 19/20 makes the wrong decision.
 
justintime said:
You are correct in that. It is a professional foul situation and 1-1 is better than 1-2 loss. Many times I feel that our players do not have a brain. Not only under ETH but these same players under Ole too.
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I certainly think there’s a few to many nice boys in the club and not enough killers.

Think the wiser boys who’ve been round the block like Casemiro or Evans and taking Traore down for the red card because that is what needs to be done to protect the lead.
 
I would like to add as to what happens on the training pitch? Look at all other teams. They seem to know how to tackle. Our players apart on a 1v1 with AWB and sometimes Maguire cannot tackle. Cas tackles but is always late. It seems to be that our players think they have to win the ball of the opposing player all the time. No. His first job is to make the opposing player lose possession. That gives an opportunity for one of our players to gain possession. Look at the distance our players are to the player in possession. Not close enough to pick up possession or too close to our own player so that one of the opposing player can cover the space needed.
 
jsp said:
Probably will end up being a waste of money. Feels like we’ve signed a keeper to suit a certain way of playing that we haven’t been able to play because of the injuries. We have also massively overpaid for him off the back of a good season. At that price he should be a lot better than he is but I think he’d also benefit from the team in front of him stopping the Number of shots he faces every week.

I think with Maguire if there’s offers in the summer we should take them. Think a move will do him good with Utd there’s to much negative history I’d like to see us build a new partnership with *fingers crossed* a fit Martinez next season.
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Doesn't make a lot of sense to build a squad/defence around an injured player and move the one on who's been helping out the team in defence most recently. I guess Maguire can't ever be good enough in your eyes, and that's fine. I can too see he still isn't quite there for our level, or at least the one we want to achieve, but I feel he now at least deserves the chance to try and make the way to the top and be good enough. He's had plenty of good games recently and maybe even some of them he was worth his wages. If you don't let a player progress then you'll never know. I think now is the ideal time to see if he can make it work - now and next season. I don't know what sort of figure would make sense to sell, because probably everyone has one, but I feel like most supporters would let him go for next to nothing, and it is sort of his fault. I just like to support the players, the ones that seem like they're trying to make a go of it. There doesn't look to be too many of those in the squad on a really tough day like Saturday. Yet Maguire stood up to some extent and did not give up.
 
Maguire makes too many mistakes still, but they are not being punished so much.

On Saturday, he dived into the tackle that led to the goal, that left him for dead. He should have taken the player out
 
Jayc1860 said:
Doesn't make a lot of sense to build a squad/defence around an injured player and move the one on who's been helping out the team in defence most recently. I guess Maguire can't ever be good enough in your eyes, and that's fine. I can too see he still isn't quite there for our level, or at least the one we want to achieve, but I feel he now at least deserves the chance to try and make the way to the top and be good enough. He's had plenty of good games recently and maybe even some of them he was worth his wages. If you don't let a player progress then you'll never know. I think now is the ideal time to see if he can make it work - now and next season. I don't know what sort of figure would make sense to sell, because probably everyone has one, but I feel like most supporters would let him go for next to nothing, and it is sort of his fault. I just like to support the players, the ones that seem like they're trying to make a go of it. There doesn't look to be too many of those in the squad on a really tough day like Saturday. Yet Maguire stood up to some extent and did not give up.
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I agree it's a risk but I don't think the Martinez injuries are going to be a long term issue. Think he's just had some bad luck and I'm working on the basis he will be back to his best next season. If the docs say this current knee injury is a concern then of course the club will have to change plans over what they do this summer we can't have 1 injury totally ripping up the way the team plays.

I was a big supporter of Maguire through his first 2 seasons at the club he was a very good defender (not up to his price tag but still very good) but in my opinion he's declined and the way we seem to want to play now doesn't suit him. He's been steady this season but I want to see the club change and move forward and that means letting players who've had their chance move on to something new.

He can still do a job but he's on big wages and his contract I think is about to enter the last 12 months so I think it's the right time to try and move him on while we can still get a transfer fee for him.

If the club are going to try and be a pressing team that defends on the half way line as most top sides now do then his lack of recovery speed is a problem and is only going to become a bigger problem as he gets older.
 
Maguire is no slower than Koeman and yes his passing is not up to that level either but Maguire playing the last defender is going to get punished no matter what. Maguire playing as the forward CB is going to be much better.
 
jsp said:
I agree it's a risk but I don't think the Martinez injuries are going to be a long term issue. Think he's just had some bad luck and I'm working on the basis he will be back to his best next season. If the docs say this current knee injury is a concern then of course the club will have to change plans over what they do this summer we can't have 1 injury totally ripping up the way the team plays.

I was a big supporter of Maguire through his first 2 seasons at the club he was a very good defender (not up to his price tag but still very good) but in my opinion he's declined and the way we seem to want to play now doesn't suit him. He's been steady this season but I want to see the club change and move forward and that means letting players who've had their chance move on to something new.

He can still do a job but he's on big wages and his contract I think is about to enter the last 12 months so I think it's the right time to try and move him on while we can still get a transfer fee for him.

If the club are going to try and be a pressing team that defends on the half way line as most top sides now do then his lack of recovery speed is a problem and is only going to become a bigger problem as he gets older.
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I see the argument for getting rid, definitely. The majority of the fan base would agree with you I'd say. My loyalty for players can be a bit much sometimes I guess. I am still in the zone of giving him one more season, but the reality is if ETH doesn't stay he is probably gone, as I feel the manager will feel the same as me and remember those players who fought for him in his time of need.

I do hope you're right too, and that Martinez can become injury free, he is easily our best defender, but something just doesn't sit right with me since his initial injury, he's not been able to have any impact for us this season at all. I think he's been out the majority of games hasn't he? This next return for him is crucial, he must stay fit or he's entering the realms of pointless.
 
Jayc1860 said:
I do hope you're right too, and that Martinez can become injury free, he is easily our best defender, but something just doesn't sit right with me since his initial injury, he's not been able to have any impact for us this season at all. I think he's been out the majority of games hasn't he? This next return for him is crucial, he must stay fit or he's entering the realms of pointless.
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I think with Martinez he's been unlucky he's had to have two lots of surgery to fix the broken foot he suffered last season that shouldn't really happen but it does and the second injury he suffered was a freak injury where a player landed on him and injured his knee. Same thing happened to Jota the other day just an unfortunate thing in a contact sport.

Hopefully that's just a bad year and not a sign of things to come.
 
jsp said:
I think with Martinez he's been unlucky he's had to have two lots of surgery to fix the broken foot he suffered last season that shouldn't really happen but it does and the second injury he suffered was a freak injury where a player landed on him and injured his knee. Same thing happened to Jota the other day just an unfortunate thing in a contact sport.

Hopefully that's just a bad year and not a sign of things to come.
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Sadly, there are people in this world who are just unlucky. I'm starting to see this in Martinez.
 

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