Coronavirus in sport

Neutral venues is a bad idea alright. Regarding the same competition, this is a unique situation requiring compromise. I doubt anyone isn't aware of that.
 
PSG crowned French champions.

Got to expect Liverpool will be given the title if the FA cancel the season.
 
Yeah they've gone on a points per game basis so they've also relegated teams as a result they even said in their statement they expect appeals but as far as were concerned it was the only possible solution in this rather unique position.

Was surprised they declared PSG champion I know in Netherlands they didn't award Ajax the title but I think they were only a few points clear I thought they follow suit in France PSG finish 1st but no title is awarded as the season didn't finish. Think Ajax basically said they didn't really want to be awarded the title in the circumstances.

I expect they'll award the title to Liverpool if we go the same way and decide to end the season as things stand guess we can always mock that little Asterix that will go next to it.
 
I can’t see us going that route and relegating teams that haven’t been relegated yet.
 
IDFD said:
I can’t see us going that route and relegating teams that haven’t been relegated yet.
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Depends what the EFL do I guess can you really deny teams promotion because you can't relegate teams?

Could be a 2 up 2 down situation because they can't do the playoffs but again that's more rule changes and more legal challenges from both leagues. What happens if the PL finishes but the EFL doesn't can you promote teams when seasons down finish?

Might also be different here because of the money involved not sure what it's like in France but I'm guessing the financial gap between Ligue 1 & 2 isn't as extreme as the gap between the PL & Championship. Playoffs also complicate things a bit.

If there was no relegation the PL could pay a one off bonus to the EFL from the next TV deal to distribute to all the teams based on where they currently finish as a form of compensation. This would mean all PL clubs accepting a smaller pot for next season so can't see that one going anywhere but it might be cheaper than the league going to court.

If it came to a vote there's probably 14 teams who are happy enough to end it as it is. Man Utd, Wolves and Sheff Utd plus the bottom 3 might be the only teams to vote against it.

If they go to points per game which deals with the 4 teams who currently have a game in hand.

Top 4 remains unchanged.

5th Man Utd 1.55
6th Sheff Utd 1.54
7th Wolves 1.48
8th Arsenal 1.43
9th Spurs 1.41

That win vs City was a huge swing for us. Man Utd, Sheff Utd & Wolves would go into Europa League if City are still banned from Europe then Utd would go to CL and Arsenal would go to Europa League.

At the bottom Norwich finish bottom on 0.72ppg, second bottom Villa 0.89 & 3rd bottom Bournemouth on 0.93 (they'd be relegated on goal difference by 1 goal).
 
This whole thing is madness. The season wasn't finished, therefore no winners or losers. Anything else is just serving one agenda over another, and (imho) Liverpool do not "deserve" to be declared winners any more than any of the teams in the drop zone deserve to be relegated. The conditions were not met for both outcomes. If they are going to pretend the unplayed matches would have resulted in the table staying the same that means they are attributing fantasy goals to players, so why not add scoreline to all these fantasy matches? Might as well award golden boot based on projections. If you can say the relegated clubs would have lost the games that could have saved them, you have to assign which player would have scored those goals, right? None of it makes any sense.

I was thinking the only fair solution is to resume the competition and finish the unplayed games, which seems to be how they set things up in Spain. But as I've read about how different countries are doing it, I now thing the only fair solution is to void it all. Let's say Pogba was our top scorer and now he's out of contract and leaving: how would it be fair to MUFC to play the unplayed fixtures with different players against different opponents? The whole thing is a clusterf*ck.

I realize CL and EL would be affected, but again, conditions were not met for determining who gets to compete, so they should call those competitions something else for one season if they want to go ahead with either last season's competitors or select teams based on the unfinished leagues. In either case, the criteria for CL places wasn't met.

The FA's own rules about abandoned games:
"…any League Match which from any cause whatever falls short of 90 (ninety) minutes’ duration may be ordered to count as a completed fixture or be replayed in full or in part on whatever terms and conditions the Board shall in their absolute discretion determine and shall be played in compliance with these Regulations and the Football Association Rules respectively and under the Laws of the Game as approved by the International Football Association Board”.

I think Spain's approach is better and fairer: "Each country has its own rules and regulations about such things. In Spain, for example, a match that is already partway through isn’t abandoned, it is merely postponed to a later date. This means that if a game is halted after 68 minutes with one team 3-0 up then it will be resumed at a later date with the remaining 22 minutes played out."

The money clubs get based on where they finish in the table should be divided up equally (not proportionally) and they should include the clubs that would have been promoted, IF they insist on declaring winners and losers.


Why Do Football Matches Get Abandoned and What Happens When They Are? | Football-Stadiums.co.uk

Why Are Football Matches Abandoned and What Happens When They Are? Nowadays football matches are, thankfully, very rarely abandoned. It does happen, however, so you’re probably wondering why. What is it that causes the abandonment of a game of footba...
www.football-stadiums.co.uk www.football-stadiums.co.uk
 
I think the rule book is out the window at this stage @Cosmic Slop everyone is free to do what they want this situation wasn’t in the rule book.

I do think you have to award the prize money based on the current table and you’ll need to put forward your european clubs based on current table as UEFA have told everyone they must do it this way if leagues cannot compete. If the games don’t happen all the broadcaster will need refunds, fans need refunds on season tickets and maybe even sponsors. Club revenue may drop considerably over next 2-3 seasons. Relegation/Promotion remains the hardest bit to square off in England if things don’t finish as the same principle needs to be applied through the 4 top division.

I’d be amazed if all of the football leagues survive this so many were right on the brink financially surely it’s logical that at least 1 go bust.

German government has delayed its decision on the bundesliga plans by 1 week saying they need more time to consider.
 
jsp said:
I think the rule book is out the window at this stage @Cosmic Slop everyone is free to do what they want this situation wasn’t in the rule book.

I do think you have to award the prize money based on the current table and you’ll need to put forward your european clubs based on current table as UEFA have told everyone they must do it this way if leagues cannot compete. If the games don’t happen all the broadcaster will need refunds, fans need refunds on season tickets and maybe even sponsors. Club revenue may drop considerably over next 2-3 seasons. Relegation/Promotion remains the hardest bit to square off in England if things don’t finish as the same principle needs to be applied through the 4 top division.

I’d be amazed if all of the football leagues survive this so many were right on the brink financially surely it’s logical that at least 1 go bust.

German government has delayed its decision on the bundesliga plans by 1 week saying they need more time to consider.
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The Germans are wisely stalling to see if someone else figures it out first.

As far as the broadcasters go, that's their problem. They paid for something that wasn't delivered. Surely somewhere in those contracts are force majeure clauses, so invoke them. Either the broadcasters get a refund from insurers, or they take it on the chin. Either way I don't care what happens to them. I find it impossible to believe the English clubs don't have similar clauses and indemnifications. If lightning struck and killed some players on the pitch (as has happened in other countries) surely they would be insured for it.
 
Guys, the Germans are right to delay a decision, just as they will in England. Any decision to totally abandon the season should only be made when we are totally out of time and no solution has been found to enable the remaining fixtures to be played out where any risk has been brought down to ALARP and acceptable to all concerned, especially the players, followed by the coaching staff and other club employee's who may have difficulty maintaining social distancing. Obviously proposals would need to be Gov accepted and supported.
Within the European countries, from what I can see England is the country that is showing most will to complete the season, to find a way. They will keep trying to find a way until hope is lost. And there will be genuine sadness if the towel has to be thrown in.
I believe there is a reason for that. Britain and it's people have a real sense of fair play that outstrips everybody else. As Cosmic Slop says, if you cancel the season then it really should become null and void. The decisions made in France is totally ridiculous and knowing such decisions would have to be made was why I said they would probably do an about turn. Clearly it has gone past that now.
It may hurt, but even United fans, including born and bred Mancs (which I am not) and who are of a reasonable education know that it would be a total injustice if Liverpool were not crowned champions for the 19/20 Season.
The will is there, the sporting nature is there to try and conclude things as they should be concluded. It remains to be seen if it is achievable. It will only be abandoned when we know it needs to be. That is not presently the case.
 
Then again, having read my last post back. Maybe I have been getting carried away with Tom Kirkman lately. I'm into Season 3 now :p
 
The mayor of Liverpool calls the idea to restart the premier league a non starter and pathetic saying it will lead to farcical situations.
 
Shoot said:
[edit]
It may hurt, but even United fans, including born and bred Mancs (which I am not) and who are of a reasonable education know that it would be a total injustice if Liverpool were not crowned champions for the 19/20 Season.
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I beg to differ. It would be a total injustice to award Liverpool the crown for winning 19/20 season, because they didn't win it.

It reeks of the decision to let Liverpool play in the CL league the year after they won it, even though they finished in like 7th. It's farcical.

In what other sport would they hand out winners' medals when the competition wasn't finished? Would they award the Tour De France if the last 2 stages hadn't been raced? Would they award Wimbledon if they didn't finish their sets? Or a horse race? There are a lot of pundits and former players who have an agenda with some sort of nostalgia for Liverpool's dominance, and even some utter nonsense about "sport" or "the people" want Liverpool to win.

It's not a participation trophy or a feel-good citation. They didn't win the league. If there is any possible outcome that could have shifted the final positions, then the competition was not completed to the extent demanded. The whole thing is ludicrous. Void it!
 
I don't care about Liverpool and the title, I think we would have definitely finished in the top 4. Season finishes now and we are screwed.

But that doesn't stop me thinking anything but terminating the season is a mistake. Even next season coud be difficult.
 
IDFD said:
The mayor of Liverpool calls the idea to restart the premier league a non starter and pathetic saying it will lead to farcical situations.
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You just know if Liverpool won the title behind closed doors, there would be thousands of drunk shirtless scousers flocking down to the stadium in their droves.
 
I'm torn about it. Firstly lets make no mistake and rewrite history. Liverpool were winning this league title. It was done in December. They've had one of the greatest league campaigns we'll see and would have broken numerous records. But you can't give them the title without relegating anyone and I really don't see how you can relegate Aston Villa, Bournemouth or Watford at the moment.

Ideally you'd wait and finish the season. However many of the EFL clubs like the national league clubs already can't afford to continue with months of uncertainty over their heads and if the decision isn't made soon we'll start losing clubs on a weekly basis. A clubs history isn't worth Liverpool getting their title or Aston Villa not being relegated so a decision does need to be made sooner rather than later and an effort to save these clubs made. I know some people would prefer to wait but it's fanciful situation that you just can't allow.

In terms of what was said by the Liverpool mayor. He's 100% spot on. There isn't a situation where Liverpool get the title and fans stay in doors. It isn't happening.
 
Bundesliga decision delayed.

In their health and safety plan handed to the government they’ve said they will need 300 people in the stadium to host the games behind closed doors. Each club would be appointed with an outside team H&S official. Players would be tested regularly, an infection would be reported to the government but the team wouldn’t automatically be quarantined.

The last line will probably be what cost them any chance of resuming shortly.
 
Cosmic Slop said:
The Germans are wisely stalling to see if someone else figures it out first.

As far as the broadcasters go, that's their problem. They paid for something that wasn't delivered. Surely somewhere in those contracts are force majeure clauses, so invoke them. Either the broadcasters get a refund from insurers, or they take it on the chin. Either way I don't care what happens to them. I find it impossible to believe the English clubs don't have similar clauses and indemnifications. If lightning struck and killed some players on the pitch (as has happened in other countries) surely they would be insured for it.
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The issue currently is the product is delayed and not cancelled and these agreements cover multiple seasons it's in both parties best interest to work together to solve the issue rather than involve lawyers but you can bet the arse covering letters from both sides have been sent.

My best guess is they'll negotiate a settlement if the games are cancelled possibly add 1 season on to all existing deals at a reduced rate or apply a discount for future seasons. Either way the clubs are getting a bill as currently sky/bt have not charged their customers for sports packages the only way that's happening is if in the background deals have been done to reduce out goings.

Yeah again it's all about what policies you have clubs will have insurance against events being cancelled but does that insurance cover you for pandemic some clubs would probably remove that option for a cheaper premium.
 
I was reading that most clubs won’t be covered by insurance policies. Most policies apparently will have a section for business disruption and notifiable disease but Covid will not be covered under that.
 
In terms of time aren't we already out of time? seasons need to finish by end of June due to player contracts expiring if you can't complete by then you are opening up cans of worms that can't be solved quickly.
 
IDFD said:
I was reading that most clubs won’t be covered by insurance policies. Most policies apparently will have a section for business disruption and notifiable disease but Covid will not be covered under that.
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I was wondering if like Wimbledon they have disaster insurance as football clubs are basically events companies that put on 25-30 events a year so they may have insurance that covers them for something like this I doubt it as they probably though the risk of this happening is so low.
 
jsp said:
In terms of time aren't we already out of time? seasons need to finish by end of June due to player contracts expiring if you can't complete by then you are opening up cans of worms that can't be solved quickly.
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No, we are not. Be interesting to see what comes out of today's meeting.
 
Shoot said:
No, we are not. Be interesting to see what comes out of today's meeting.
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I doubt there will be any clarity emerging of what will be happening. It still all depends on the measures enforced by the government.

Also I would presume all clubs have to 100% agree to a behind closed door restart. I have heard there needs to be a 14 club majority who agree to this project restart. However if 5 or 6 clubs refuse to restart the season because the players think it’ll be unsafe then the season cannot be started surely?

Then there is the integrity of the season if you play at neutral venues or go abroad. It’s an absolute minefield of questions and scenarios. But hey let’s see what comes out of the meeting today. One things for sure I don’t think the season will be cancelled anytime soon - think every effort will be made to try and restart it.
 
What happens if one player gets Covid, the whole squad has to isolate. I just can't see how this works.
 
My best guess is that there would be sufficient pre testing and footballers lives are football and family only, going back to the family home and remaining locked down after games and training.
If all involved have already tested negative the risk must be low with the right controls and hygiene measures in place
 
jsp said:
I was wondering if like Wimbledon they have disaster insurance as football clubs are basically events companies that put on 25-30 events a year so they may have insurance that covers them for something like this I doubt it as they probably though the risk of this happening is so low.
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I'm presuming your sense of smell and taste have returned to normal?
 
Shoot said:
No, we are not. Be interesting to see what comes out of today's meeting.
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9 weeks till contracts expire.
9 games to play
2-3 weeks training required
2-3 to get testing sorted.

Even at 2 games per week which is pretty much already agreed as being impossible we are out of time without trying to come up with quick fix patches.
 
Shoot said:
I'm presuming your sense of smell and taste have returned to normal?
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Not back to normal yet mate but getting there it's nearly 6 weeks now I'd say for the last 2 weeks it's been back to about 25% what it was can smell strong odours up close and get the odd flicker of taste when eating. Was saying to the mrs when I was eating crisps I get the sensation of the salt but can't actually taste the flavour.
 
Shoot said:
My best guess is that there would be sufficient pre testing and footballers lives are football and family only, going back to the family home and remaining locked down after games and training.
If all involved have already tested negative the risk must be low with the right controls and hygiene measures in place
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As mentioned in the press, you can catch it on your way to the testing centre. The only way this would work is when they get a test to see if you've had it. Loads of businesses are losing money had over fist, only football is considering putting all it's "staff" at huge risk. It's a joke to me and shouldn't even be considered.
 
jsp said:
9 weeks till contracts expire.
9 games to play
2-3 weeks training required
2-3 to get testing sorted.

Even at 2 games per week which is pretty much already agreed as being impossible we are out of time without trying to come up with quick fix patches.
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jsp said:
I think the rule book is out the window at this stage
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In your own words
 
Mr C said:
As mentioned in the press, you can catch it on your way to the testing centre. The only way this would work is when they get a test to see if you've had it. Loads of businesses are losing money had over fist, only football is considering putting all it's "staff" at huge risk. It's a joke to me and shouldn't even be considered.
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In my opinion there is probably about a 80% higher chance you or I would catch it when doing the shopping.
 
Shoot said:
In your own words
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Do you work for the sun because that is some fantastic editing to remove context.

"The rule book out the window" comment was in relation to how leagues want to end seasons and decide titles/promotion/relegation etc nothing to do with some cobbled together plan to finish the remaining games. If a league specifically has a what happens if the league can't be finished due to war/pandemic etc rule then that rule will have to be implemented.

In terms of how you play the games the rules are very much the rules and your contract remains your contract you can't force players to extend contracts if they don't want to and you can't force the clubs to extend those deals if they don't want to both parties have to agree a change of terms in a contract. UEFA have given clubs more time to finish their league seasons and the FA's have also passed that down but they haven't actually said what we do with players who have contracts that end in June.
 

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