Adrien Rabiot

Mr C said:
He wants more than he's on at Juve, we're right to say no or we'll be stuck with another player we can't shift due to high wages
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Yes who if this true is just another mercenary...I'm all for a player getting a good deal but some take the piss
 
They need better than they have but Rabiot isn't that much better. If he's holding out for more they should move on. I find it hard to believe he's their actual plan B anyway.
 
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How did it get this far?

Surely Utd sound out the agent over potential demands before they bother negotiating with the club.

Unless his camp bumped up their demands after we agreed the deal with Juventus then we’ve wasted our time.

That is two transfers agreed with clubs this summer only to be unable to agree personal terms with the player.
 
It's his mum, who is a proper loon. Think she wants to double his wages
 
We are now going to be scrambling around for new players.

I guess this deal could happen if Rabiot lowers his demands but if we already offered him a deal to become one of our highest earners and he rejected it, then he can do one.

I see Caicedo, Joao Felix and Casemiro linked yesterday. It’s turned into a circus.
 
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jsp said:
How did it get this far?

Surely Utd sound out the agent over potential demands before they bother negotiating with the club.

Unless his camp bumped up their demands after we agreed the deal with Juventus then we’ve wasted our time.

That is two transfers agreed with clubs this summer only to be unable to agree personal terms with the player.
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Yet again we look foolish. Everybody knows how difficult his mum is to deal with, yet we go an agree a few with the club without having a concrete agreement in place with the player and his agent.

Glad we have now pulled out of any deal, if his demands were ridiculous.
 
i think we're being a bit hard on united here.

You're not meant to go to the player first. We spoke to the club, agreed a fee and then spoke to player, his demands are unrealistic. that's that.

The worry is, and the one I have been making all summer, what are our analysis and scouting departments doing. He should not be on our list in the first place.

We have no realistic targets for any position because the background teams are non existent or terrible. I can't see us doing any meaningful business this summer, and that will affect us long term. We thought attracting players this season was hard. We carry on in this vein and it will be worse next summer.
 
Mr C said:
i think we're being a bit hard on united here.

You're not meant to go to the player first. We spoke to the club, agreed a fee and them spoke to player, his demands are unrealistic. that's that.

The worry is, and the one have been making all summer, what are analysis and scouting departments doing. He should not be on our list in the first place.

We have no realistic targets for any position because the background teams are non existent or terrible. I can't see us doing any meaningful business this summer, and that will affect us long term. We thought attracting players this season was hard. We carry on in this vein and it will be worse next summer.
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No but literally everyone does it this way to avoid wasting time. The agent will know is the player open to a move, is the club willing to sell and at what sort of price and what would the player expect.

It just feels like to me Utd are no longer connected into the network of powerful people in football they don’t have their finger on the pulse anymore. They see Utd as a joke which is why when we come along the price goes up as everyone knows we are easy to rip off.

The club I think made the correct decision but we’ve wasted a week to get to this point.
 
There have been plenty of transfers completed this summer where terms have been agreed with the player and then talks held with the club to agree a fee.

Can I work for our scouting department and put my feet up all day?
 
This is the first bit of good business we’ve done all summer. We cannot keep giving out massive contracts to mediocre players and then wonder why we can’t shift them in 18 months time.
Completely agree it shouldn’t have got to this point though.
 
I don't put blame so much on United here. I guess in a way they've brought it on themselves but ultimately Rabiot is asking for too much it seems. They are doing the right thing by pulling the plug I think. But at the same time this is the position they've got themselves in. Clubs and players know they are desperate and that pushes up the price.
 
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Seems to have been quiet this season off the pitch and he's been good on it, so maybe a corner turned?

Utd need serious reinforcements in midfield so not surprised if we do look to go for players on contracts that are expiring.
 
Ugh. We dodged this bullet last summer, why are we now willingly walking up to the gun, pointing it at our heads and pulling the trigger? How bad is our scouting department when we can't identify a young up and coming player to get on the cheap instead of these old has beens/never weres?
 
Cruella ne Ville said:
Ugh. We dodged this bullet last summer, why are we now willingly walking up to the gun, pointing it at our heads and pulling the trigger? How bad is our scouting department when we can't identify a young up and coming player to get on the cheap instead of these old has beens/never weres?
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Think the question is does he improve the squad? Of the current options who is he better than. Casemiro? No, Eriksen? Probably, Fred/McTominay/Donny? Absolutey yes.

If you get him on a free you still need to buy another midfielder but it probably means you can sell Fred/McTominay/Donny who you know aren't good enough.
 
jsp said:
Think the question is does he improve the squad? Of the current options who is he better than. Casemiro? No, Eriksen? Probably, Fred/McTominay/Donny? Absolutey yes.

If you get him on a free you still need to buy another midfielder but it probably means you can sell Fred/McTominay/Donny who you know aren't good enough.
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No the problem, is you will get Rabiot on a free only if you garanty him play Time. You can't have Rabiot and buy a better midfielder than him. I think we can have better option than Rabiot
 
Lordkluivert said:
No the problem, is you will get Rabiot on a free only if you garanty him play Time. You can't have Rabiot and buy a better midfielder than him. I think we can have better option than Rabiot
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Well no player should be guaranteed a starting spot and if he wants that then we walk away.

The only assurance a player should get is that if you play well you'll be treated equally to all other players and with champions league football and 2 cups there will need to be rotation in the midfield before and during games.

My argument is buying Rabiot and another midfielder means you can sell both McTominay and Fred as they aren't good enough.
 
jsp said:
Think the question is does he improve the squad? Of the current options who is he better than. Casemiro? No, Eriksen? Probably, Fred/McTominay/Donny? Absolutey yes.

If you get him on a free you still need to buy another midfielder but it probably means you can sell Fred/McTominay/Donny who you know aren't good enough.
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Casemiro needs to start most matches. Eriksen turns into a pumpkin at the 60 min mark and would probably be better coming off the bench. While Rabiot is better than our deadwood, we should be looking for a Eriksen replacement alongside Casemiro. Is Rabiot starting 50 matches next season going to help us bridge the gap to City? No.

Free transfers aren't free. Agent fees, signing on fees etc., increased wages all add up. He's going to want a 4/5 year deal taking him to 32/33 years old. At best we get value out of the first two years of that deal and then he's deadwood we can't shift. If we're going to go for players to raise the floor, I'd rather take a punt on some young potential who might become first team quality.
 
Cruella ne Ville said:
Casemiro needs to start most matches. Eriksen turns into a pumpkin at the 60 min mark and would probably be better coming off the bench. While Rabiot is better than our deadwood, we should be looking for a Eriksen replacement alongside Casemiro. Is Rabiot starting 50 matches next season going to help us bridge the gap to City? No.

Free transfers aren't free. Agent fees, signing on fees etc., increased wages all add up. He's going to want a 4/5 year deal taking him to 32/33 years old. At best we get value out of the first two years of that deal and then he's deadwood we can't shift. If we're going to go for players to raise the floor, I'd rather take a punt on some young potential who might become first team quality.
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100% Utd need to spend £50-100m on an Eriksen upgrade that is a player like Caicedo, De Jong or Rice a top quality centre mid who can go with Casemiro most weeks, that player probably needs to be 20-25 years old. I also think we need to look at selling Fred/McTominay (Fred needs a new contract) and bringing in another player who will need to be cheaper. If we sold those two you might raise £40m to go towards that player.

With Rabiot I think you have to judge it on his ability he is a good player but if he's asking for crazy wages you just walk away he'd need to come in and fit within the wage structure of the squad players £100k a week plus decent bonuses that are performance based and you offer him a 3 plus 1 deal.
 
doesn't he cause problems if not picked? sort of player we've made the mistake of getting post Fergie.

WTF is our scouting dept doing? we need to get the Brighton team of scouts

absolute no from me.
 
Mr C said:
doesn't he cause problems if not picked? sort of player we've made the mistake of getting post Fergie.

WTF is our scouting dept doing? we need to get the Brighton team of scouts

absolute no from me.
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Before Caicedo came to Brighton we were in for him, but we decided to look elsewere only to be forced to pay premium Price for him some years after. We keep Moving away from young potential and prefer proven 25yo players. That has to stop. Take a risk on a promissing 21 yo is the way to go. Look at Real with Vini, Valverde, Rodrigo and Camaviga. Young is good enough. Now go and get us Gravenberch, Thuram, Kone, Le Fée and play some good football.
 
Mr C said:
doesn't he cause problems if not picked? sort of player we've made the mistake of getting post Fergie.

WTF is our scouting dept doing? we need to get the Brighton team of scouts

absolute no from me.
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Exactly, as soon as hé is not picked his mother cry to the press and manager. We better avoid this 28yo and go young and hungry for sucess.
 
Mr C said:
doesn't he cause problems if not picked? sort of player we've made the mistake of getting post Fergie.

WTF is our scouting dept doing? we need to get the Brighton team of scouts

absolute no from me.
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Why? They may have good contacts in South America but they can bring a raft of players over on the cheap and let them develop at their own pace with no, or little media attention, some develop some don't and we only hear about those that do well - plus the players don't have such a demanding fanbase on their case when they occasionally underperform.
 
Lordkluivert said:
Before Caicedo came to Brighton we were in for him, but we decided to look elsewere only to be forced to pay premium Price for him some years after. We keep Moving away from young potential and prefer proven 25yo players. That has to stop. Take a risk on a promissing 21 yo is the way to go. Look at Real with Vini, Valverde, Rodrigo and Camaviga. Young is good enough. Now go and get us Gravenberch, Thuram, Kone, Le Fée and play some good football.
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I think the issue with Caicedo was also timing. He was being shopped around to all the top clubs and none them took the bait so Brighton got in there and took the gamble which has massively paid off. As a club they have invested big money into South American scouting to try to find hidden gems and buy these players straight from source rather than wait for them to get to Europe.

At the point where Caicedo emerged and was available Utd didn’t know who the manager was going to be in the summer. We were in limbo under Rangnick not really knowing which direction we would be going so it’s hardly a surprise that in that January window we didn’t buy any players.

Hopefully now 12 months in the scouting department is aligned to what the manager needs and our list of options will be longer than just players who the manager has worked with previously…. and Casemiro.
 
jsp said:
100% Utd need to spend £50-100m on an Eriksen upgrade that is a player like Caicedo, De Jong or Rice a top quality centre mid who can go with Casemiro most weeks, that player probably needs to be 20-25 years old. I also think we need to look at selling Fred/McTominay (Fred needs a new contract) and bringing in another player who will need to be cheaper. If we sold those two you might raise £40m to go towards that player.
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A lot is going to depend on the budget which obviously depends on the ownership situation. I'm thinking any CF blows most of the budget, which is top priority. If we're selling to buy after that, then McFred/Maguire/Sancho might raise enough to get a proper CM to partner Casemiro. I think FdJ has nailed his colours to the Barca mast, and Caicedo/Rice aren't going to be cheap so we might need to look abroad.

jsp said:
With Rabiot I think you have to judge it on his ability he is a good player but if he's asking for crazy wages you just walk away he'd need to come in and fit within the wage structure of the squad players £100k a week plus decent bonuses that are performance based and you offer him a 3 plus 1 deal.
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Is he going to be ok with a bit part on a bit part player's deal? Pretty sure he's kicked off for less before, and we've finally gotten rid of that sort of attitude, bringing in another malcontent would be a mistake.
 
Justin Cider said:
Why? They may have good contacts in South America but they can bring a raft of players over on the cheap and let them develop at their own pace with no, or little media attention, some develop some don't and we only hear about those that do well - plus the players don't have such a demanding fanbase on their case when they occasionally underperform.
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That’s a good point (knew you had it in you)!

If a player comes over to United or Madrid for example, then they are instantly plunged into the limelight. However, if they come over under the radar to a smaller club then they can just go about their business without any hype.

We would like to see us hoover up the best young players but sometimes it’s better for players to join those smaller clubs and continue their development.
 
What's the point in a scouting team then.

I don't think we should be blowing millions on established players. Hasn't exactly worked out, Pogba, Lukaku, Di Maria, Maguire, Sancho etc etc

As a fan base, I'd say we're more likely to give the less known more of a chance.
 
Cruella ne Ville said:
A lot is going to depend on the budget which obviously depends on the ownership situation. I'm thinking any CF blows most of the budget, which is top priority. If we're selling to buy after that, then McFred/Maguire/Sancho might raise enough to get a proper CM to partner Casemiro. I think FdJ has nailed his colours to the Barca mast, and Caicedo/Rice aren't going to be cheap so we might need to look abroad.

Is he going to be ok with a bit part on a bit part player's deal? Pretty sure he's kicked off for less before, and we've finally gotten rid of that sort of attitude, bringing in another malcontent would be a mistake.
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Yeah the budget will dictate a lot of plans but if the club can shift most of the players they want they could raise 100m in sales add that to the usual 150m budget the club can create through its own money and there’s scope for a few big moves.

I think Caicedo is going to be about 70m and Rice 100m.

If he isn’t willing to accept that sort of offer then Utd have to look elsewhere and I don’t think ETH will bring someone in that he doesn’t think will settle into the group and team ethic he’s building.
 
SuperRash said:
That’s a good point (knew you had it in you)!

If a player comes over to United or Madrid for example, then they are instantly plunged into the limelight. However, if they come over under the radar to a smaller club then they can just go about their business without any hype.

We would like to see us hoover up the best young players but sometimes it’s better for players to join those smaller clubs and continue their development.
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Nope, Real didn't wait they have Taken Vini, Rodrigo, Valverde and Camaviga young (under 21). We should look to do the same
 

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