Video Assistant Referee (VAR) - Yes or No? | Clubs Vote Yes

VAR is just a shambles of a system. If you have a technological system then it needs to produce 100% correct results.
 
Turns out it was checked but the VAR team thought the goal was given they didn’t realise the flag went up for offside.

What a shambles.
 
SuperRash said:
VAR is just a shambles of a system. If you have a technological system then it needs to produce 100% correct results.
Click to expand...
There is nothing wrong with the system, it works in other sports.

The problem with football is the standard of the officials, and this will remain VAR or no VAR, how one set of officials can give handball one game, and another set, in another match not is a joke.

The sooner they bring in the automatic offside they are trialling the better. So then it just gets used for penalties/handball, off the ball stuff etc. And the officials need to get better.

And the fans need to be brought into it more, by mic'ing up refs, and showing everything discussed ona screen, to make it more inclusive. So they need to also follow through with booking swearing so this won't get picked up.
 
How do other sports use it though?
Tennis is very simple it is ball in or ball out nice and simple.
Cricket it still isn't perfect but it works pretty well the only thing the umpires have to really judge for themselves is a grounded catch or a run out.
Rugby left to the refs judgement if he feels there was something that needed to be checked on a try he sends it up for review. Do they get everything right? I don't know I don't follow the sport, I suspect there's still controversial decisions.

VAR is designed to find fault in every goal that is scored and with it being the worlds biggest sport it has way more focus on it than any other sport.

The other issue is the rules in football, they are not absolutely clear in the way most of sports are and with it being such a low scoring game the impact of a bad decision is huge. I heard Clattenburg on a TV yesterday saying he didn't think the Ward one in the Palace game was handball, that is handball every day of every week for the last 10 years.

I don't think we need to heard the refs conversations live, the commentators can hear it so they can feed that to the fans. They are also doing regular shows now through the premier league where they're talking through decisions, playing the audio and explaining how mistakes were made. I don't think it would hurt for the audio to be released after the games once it can be edited to remove any bad language.

Saturday was just embarrassing for the PGMOL the incident in the spurs game was a complete balls up by the officials. The communication between VAR and the team on the pitch failed and it resulted in a goal that VAR deemed to be a goal being ruled out.
 
www.theguardian.com

Furious Liverpool call VAR errors ‘unacceptable’ and ponder action

Liverpool have released a statement criticising the PGMOL following VAR errors during their 2-1 defeat at Tottenham
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

Liverpool didn't pull any punches but I don't really see what they're trying to get at here.

Do they really think the league are going to replay the game or give them points or is this more likely them attempting to apply even more pressure on the refs to make sure decisions go there way going forward.
 
jsp said:
VAR is designed to find fault in every goal that is scored and with it being the worlds biggest sport it has way more focus on it than any other sport
Click to expand...
But the problem isn't VAR it's with the people who use it.
jsp said:
I don't think we need to heard the refs conversations live, the commentators can hear it so they can feed that to the fans
Click to expand...
Not sure how commentators get stuff through to the fans, I've never listened to commentry while at a match. I have really enjoyed the way Rugby mic up the refs and show everything on the screen. It's really inclusive and stops the fans just wondering what the hell is going on.

The main controveries are over offside and handall. I don't know how well the offide tech is coming along, but the sooner the better.

Fundamentally, the officials in football are not good enough, there are way too many mistakes, and thst isn't VAR, it's the people who use it. For a game where players earn 300 grand a week, and is big money, I don't think the officials are up to teh same level at the moment.


As for the Liverpool match, that was unusually bad, but come on, dry your eyes, we had a penalty missed. If tehy back track on that everyone will be on at them to change decisions. They'll just go go back to their old way of getting every decision for months to make up for it.
 
They are talking about thi son R5 this morning now.

Somebody just said in Germany this year, a penalty was disallowed for offside, or something. The player was subbed off. Then VAR said it should have been a penalty and it was awarded. But the player should have been sent off, but he was already subbed. So they kept their 11 players.
 
Necastle fan now phoning about Liverpool, saying they need to shut up haha. Apparently a Newcastle goal vs Liverpool was given as offiside last season but wasn't ofside.
Saying basically Klopp likes to mouth off, probably to avoid talking about all their sending offs.
 
Mr C said:
But the problem isn't VAR it's with the people who use it.

Not sure how commentators get stuff through to the fans, I've never listened to commentry while at a match. I have really enjoyed the way Rugby mic up the refs and show everything on the screen. It's really inclusive and stops the fans just wondering what the hell is going on.

The main controveries are over offside and handall. I don't know how well the offide tech is coming along, but the sooner the better.

Fundamentally, the officials in football are not good enough, there are way too many mistakes, and thst isn't VAR, it's the people who use it. For a game where players earn 300 grand a week, and is big money, I don't think the officials are up to teh same level at the moment.

As for the Liverpool match, that was unusually bad, but come on, dry your eyes, we had a penalty missed. If tehy back track on that everyone will be on at them to change decisions. They'll just go go back to their old way of getting every decision for months to make up for it.
Click to expand...

VAR is a person though it is a person watching a replay making decision based on what they see it will always have human error. Very little is actually technology stepping in to give accuracy it's just a person trying their best to check things.

On TV you often hear them say that's been checked by VAR nothing to see or that there's a VAR check going on in the background as play continues. It doesn't help people in the ground but I'm not sure how we deal with that they can't put it over the speakers if the game is still going on and not all grounds have a big screen to alert you.

I actually felt like they were getting the offside stuff right the automated stuff would just help speed it up. The only ones you can really doubt are the ones where they have to decide if a player is active or not.

I agree the standard of officiating isn't great but I'm not convinced it's any worse than it was before there's just a lot more focus on it. Bad decisions have been part of football forever but now we have 20 odd HD cameras at every game to catch every mistake from every angle. TV companies spend an hour after the game going through every decision then the next day they get an old ref in to go over it all again on their 24 hours news channel.

There is no solution to human error. The refs get most things right first time and with VAR they correct most of the errors but there's still certain things that come down to how the ref applies the rules.

Players make mistakes, managers make mistakes and officials make mistakes it's all part of the game and in reality no one gets hurt at the end of it you just have to deal with it and move on. No one is making these mistakes on purpose.
 
What will be interesting was how quickly after the game restarted did they realise they'd made a massive error?

The suggestion is they realised pretty quickly that they had got it wrong but because the game restarted they couldn't do anything about it.
 
It wasn't even a mistake at liverpool, it was comunication error, for some reason the VAR team thought the on field decision was a goal.
 
Yeah but it's still a mistake the ref and the VAR weren't on the same page.

Feels like that is the first time this has happened since VAR came in so it's a freak accident.

I guess what they need to look at is how the ref and VAR communicate it needs to be clear to the VAR what the on field decision is and the VAR needs to respond with what needs to be awarded. "Check Complete Goal" or "Check Complete No Goal"
 
What was quite interesting on that show they did going through decisions a few weeks ago is just how much they're talking to each other during games it's pretty much non stop between the ref, assistants and the VAR team for 90 minutes.

Seems crazy that they aren't allowed to provide absolute clarity of their decision by saying award the goal or don't award the goal.

They're also under pressure to make quick decisions so from the sound of it they didn't draw both sets of lines they set the defender line and could clearly see the attacker was onside so tried to give a quick decision. In that time where they started checking the lines they totally missed that the flag had gone up and that the goal had been disallowed they think they're checking that it's ok to give a goal that's been allowed.

I know in cricket and rugby when they go to review part of the process is the on field umpire/referee has to say what the on field decision is before they carry out a check.
 
Humans and computers make errors, deal with it.

Right i'm off to put the milk back in the washing-machine ....
 
Another bad weekend.

How was Oliver not sent to the screen to review the tackle by Kovacic that is a red card all day long. Would have put him out of their next 3 games as well.

Even worse 5 minutes later the ref didn't give him a 2nd yellow.

What is worrying about that is Howard Webb defending it by basically saying refs will try and keep 11 vs 11 on the pitch. I'm sorry the rules are the rules and if you make two poor tackles that are worth yellow cards you should be off. Doesn't matter if they're 5 minutes apart of 50 minutes apart the reason you get a yellow card is to make you be more cautious in the way you play.
 
Another weekend of controversy, the Newcastle goal was just a shambles. On eye the ball was definitely out, probably more out than the Rashford ‘assist’ against Brighton. Then they checked for the Joelinton foul against Gabriel which it probably was a foul. Then for good measure checked the offside. Four or five minutes of bumbling around and probably came to the wrong decision.

Havertz should have been sent off as well for a studs up tackle.

The penalty Sheffield Utd got at the end vs Wolves was so so soft.

The inconsistency is rife and for me it is totally ruining the enjoyment of football. We have had some decisions go against us this season but so have most clubs to be fair.

There is so much incompetency on and off the field that VAR is just becoming an absolute joke.
 
VAR does seem to be having a nightmare of a season. Expect changes will be made as this current iteration is just pissing people off.
 
Think yesterday just showed how lumbering the process is when you have multiple checks to do and since that Spurs/Liverpool fiasco they’re taking extra time to do the checks.

Yesterday for the McT disallowed goal they had to do 3 separate offside checks before then sending the ref to the monitor. Why even send him over? Just wastes another minute once they confirm Maguire is offside and he tries to play the ball then he’s offside and the goal has to be ruled out.

The Newcastle one is even more blurry really all they can check for certain is the foul. The camera can’t tell you if the ball is out when it’s that close you need a camera over the top of the ball to be sure. Time it looks a foul Joelinton has to hands in Gabriel’s back as he jumps tome that’s a foul. That goal either way would be controversial had they ruled it out then it would be Newcastle spitting feathers over it.

Both of these checks took nearly 5 minutes to complete all while fans have no idea what is going on.

As for the Wolves one that’s twice in 2 games that has happened to them. It’s a shocking decision the sheff Utd player didn’t even try to appeal it he was straight up playing on. I can get how at full speed the ref might give it but VAR has to be sending him for another look.

I think what we are seeing is a very poor group of on field officials then the way they want VAR to stay out of things means we are sticking with bad on field decisions.
 
To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.
 
Shows how ridiculous it was for the Hojlund goal vs Brighton to be ruled out earlier in the season.
 
30 minutes into Spurs Vs Chelsea.

Think we’ve had 10 minutes plus of VAR reviews.
 
For any of the Rugby fans amongst can you help me with this?

In Rugby they have their version of VAR called TMO. When a decision is checked by TMO does the on field ref ever go to the monitor to review the decision himself or is it up to the TMO to decide the outcome.

From watching some games casually my memory is when they went to TMO it was up to that person to make the final decision and report back to the on field decision. The on field guy was never sent to a monitor to check.

This is one of my major issues with VAR, the on field review by the referee is totally pointless and a waste of time. If VAR say it's a penalty, red card or whatever then they should own that decision make the change and we move on. This probably adds minimum 60 seconds to every check that gets sent to review and also seems to always result in the decision being changed. The on field ref never tells VAR they're wrong and they're sticking to the original decision.
 
Must have been a little extra in the envelope of cash delivered by City today to the officials. Joke of a decision on that penalty. If that’s a penalty these days then I give up.
 
Ridiculous penalty decision both players were pulling shirts
 
Just seen it, if it was united, I'd be pissed off if we didn't get a pen for that. So it's a pen for me
 
It’s never a penalty. Reminded me a lot of the one City got against us. City are the only team that get those ones.
 
Think you guys are thinking a penalty is like it was when we were kids playing.

On another note, just seen a clip of a Liverpool player making the same tackle as rashford, the following night, in Europe. Not even a yellow

I think the real problem with VAR is the incondisy
 
It was six of one half a dozen of the other. If the foul on Haaland is a foul, then the build up on Cucurella was also a foul, so hence it should have been overturned. Ridiculous decision and another sign of the incompetence in the officials VAR basement.
 
One player was looking at the ball, one was looking at the player, the chelsea player started it, resulted in Haaland stumbling and missing a goal scoring chance.

Look it's soft, but I have no problem with this, I hate defenders putting arms around players, holding them etc. It's absolutely not part of the game, but for some reason we have accepted it over the years. It's something I'd love to see leave the game.

Haaland is trying to get him off, so I'm not sure I'd call it 50/50
 
Thing is you see it from the different angles and who started it seems to change. Some angles look like Haaland some look like Cucurella and the issue I have is Haaland is never getting that ball anyway so why has the ref got involved.

The issue is the consistency that's twice in two tough away games that City have been awarded a penalty in pretty soft circumstances at 0-0. In both cases you can make a case for it being a penalty but they are rarely given by the ref or VAR. At least in this one the ref actually gave it which gave VAR no real option but to uphold the decision.

It is a penalty but it's very soft and you compare it to the holding on Maguire at the weekend on a set piece and you think when is it going to be consistent.
 
The latest series of Mic'd up with the ref is now doing the rounds.

Howard Webb gives his team a nice big pat on the back for the Maguire offside, the Gordon goal in the Newcastle game but said they made the wrong decision in the Wolves vs Newcastle game to award Newcastle a penalty.

The biggest problem currently is the fact that every goal is checked this means that some goals need 4-5 minutes to clear up every incident to make sure they haven't missed anything. On the Maguire and Gordon ones the VAR team are checking 3 or 4 different things before eventually making a decision.

It may just be that we're having a bit of cluster of these as it wasn't always this way but feels like there's 1 game a week where there's about 10 minutes of VAR reviews.
 
It seems there are as many problems now as there were before VAR.

It's meant to be if a serious error was made on pitch. For the Maguire one, I'd argue that wasn't a serious error if it takes 5 mins of review.

I think they need to leave much more to on field decisions. After all, it is part of the game. It's getting to way to clinical, except, to continue the medical analagy, the operations are being made by trainee surgeons.
 
The problem they've got is every goal has to be checked and that means checking absolutely everything because if they miss something there's an entire sh*t storm about it. The Maguire one is a good example there's no way if that didn't get flagged that there would be massive uproar over it.

By the absolute letter of the law it is offside so Utd cannot really complain but they only spot the issue as they're checking if Garnacho is onside. So they then add another layer to check.

My frustration at the moment is I don't see the point of getting the ref to go to the screen. The VAR needs to be given the authority to over rule the referee and change the decision going to the screen doesn't change anything every time they go to the screen they agree with VAR and change the decision. It just wastes more time. I don't recall a single case this season where a ref has gone to the screen and over ruled the VAR and stuck to their original call.
 

PGMOL getting their weekly Wolves apology ready.

At this point they must just have a standard statement template for Wolves.

They need to sort out these "on field decision" protocol, the VAR should be judging the decisions without any consideration of the on field decision, the game is so fast they only get one quick look at things and they'll make mistakes. If on the replay they think it's a pen or a red card then give it if they don't think it's a pen or a red card over rule it.

Take the bloody monitors away as well they're a complete waste of time no ref goes to the monitor and disagrees with VAR so cut that step out and trust the VAR's decision making.
 

Login or Register

Forgot your password?
Don't have an account? Register now
or Log in using
Back
Top