Should Ole Be Sacked As It Stands (Poll 2) 16/10/21

Should Ole be sacked as of today (16/10/21)

  • Yes

    Votes: 12 80.0%
  • No

    Votes: 3 20.0%

  • Total voters
    15
  • Poll closed .

jsp

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We can’t always go back to the treble season but if we go to 25/12/98 Utd sat 3rd in the table on 31 points, 5 points behind villa after 18 games and back then we always knew a Utd side finished strong and the Yorke/Cole partnership had clicked after a bad start. We’d also faced a seriously tough CL group.

I don’t think anyone was thinking treble but everyone was thinking we are on for the league here.

This lot look on course to do exactly what they did last season which is meander through the season probably get around 70-75 points but be nowhere near the title winners.
 

RichH2016

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That's the general held view across all sports though as form fluctuates over the season, if somebody had said we'd win the treble in 1999 having watched every United match before Christmas that season they'd have been carted off by Men in white coats. And I don't mean Butchers coats.

That's an extreme example granted, but a few scrappy wins and we're up and running again.
You're not getting it are you. For anyone to say that United fans are reacting to a fairly poor start to the year is nonsense. What they are reacting to is much more than a few games this season. They are reacting to a team who have the players to contend for major silverware but who's manager keeps making questionable decisions. To a team that isn't finding its rhythm or style after 3 years with the same manager. To the same rinse and repeat cycle that's been the case for at least 2 years now.
 

Justin Cider

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Think most have given him nearly 3 years to get things right obviously there were people who never wanted him but the vast majority got behind him and have stayed behind him but those who weren't convinced but went along with it are starting to turn and I'm one of them.

I'll admit I decided long ago I didn't think he was up to the job club rushed into giving him the permenant deal on the "ole's at the wheel" wave, but felt he deserved a bit more time to get his players in and Bruno became a breath of fresh air carried us along for 6 months. Then last season that horror show in the CL plus our dreadful start pretty much put me back in the same place there's a difference between hoping something might work and knowing it will.

This season the results and performances just put me back in that same place again he's clearly not up to the job our tactics are suicidal and he's created himself a huge problem in his squad keeping all these stars happy.

What are we being patient for? Is he suddenly going to get our back 4 organised, teach our attacking players how to press, get our midfielders to grow a pair of balls to take the ball of the defence or will he stick with this system he's played pretty much for 2 years now that isn't working?

If he left now he'd still be the best manager we've had post Ferguson he's the only one who can say they left the club in a better position than they found it in but if a top manager comes available the club have to take them as on the pitch Ole is nowhere near his competition.

Thanks @jsp, quality reply.

Just a few things, if he'd had a solid foundation to build on, and it had been a 'normal' three years I may well have similar views, but he didn't(cheers Jose the Destroyer!) and with the Pandemic where those that had been reasonably successful in 2019/20 were at a disadvantage going into last season as we didn't have anything resembling a pre-season so the fact we struggled initially shouldn't have been a great surprise, and Ole and his maligned staff deserve some credit surely for getting us up to second and getting us to a major European Final.

The clubs history is littered with horror shows in Europe, when the wheels come off they come off big style so I wasn't surprised at last season collapse, and whoever the Manager is it'll happen again it's almost in our DNA.

It's still too early in the season for me, yep we've got issues that need resolving, for starters Ole is having to play DDG, a keeper midway through last season he decided wasn't up to the job, the defence is a work in progress but we've had a lot worse, far worse, and any Manager is gonna struggle if they have to try and fit Pogba and Bruno into a working midfield, and a midfield that plays behind Ronaldo who offers little to the team if he isn't scoring goals. Has he the Cajones to drop one or two of them?

Not sure bringing in the best available is the answer(been there done that), granted they'd have a better base to work on, but it would take time to get their ideas across, and they'd go straight up against Pep, Klopp and Tuchel who are currently 3 of the best in the business who could be over the hill and far away before that happens. It would basically mean writing this season off.

I'm still 100% behind Ole, but I cringe every time I hear Ole's at the wheel, quite possibly the worst song United fans have sung regularly for years.
 

Justin Cider

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You're not getting it are you. For anyone to say that United fans are reacting to a fairly poor start to the year is nonsense. What they are reacting to is much more than a few games this season. They are reacting to a team who have the players to contend for major silverware but who's manager keeps making questionable decisions. To a team that isn't finding its rhythm or style after 3 years with the same manager. To the same rinse and repeat cycle that's been the case for at least 2 years now.

Are you sure? 85/90% of those that bothered to vote in the poll on the forum suggested Ole was the right man for the job a few weeks back, now after a few ropey performances/poor results it's the opposite which kinda suggest their opinion of Ole is based on results this season.
 

jsp

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@Justin Cider

Think the swing in the poll was the way the question is asked it’s yes or no you can’t sit on the fence last time it was asked it was far to early to sack him and it probably still is but what it highlights is how quickly people are losing faith. I voted no in the last poll but since then it’s got worse and I don’t think there’s any excuses for the manager anymore.

How many of these problem are his own creation though? The midfield is his issue as is the attack he/the club seems reluctant to let players go. VDB, Lingard, Martial, Mata should all have left the club in the summer but he didn’t want to let any go.

Neville and Carragher just did a great bit of analysis on them and where they are right now neither called for him to be sacked but both agree he’s got big problems, pressure is growing and carragher wasn’t afraid to say he’s not a world class manager and that he won’t win a league as Utd manager.
 

Justin Cider

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@Justin Cider

Think the swing in the poll was the way the question is asked it’s yes or no you can’t sit on the fence last time it was asked it was far to early to sack him and it probably still is but what it highlights is how quickly people are losing faith. I voted no in the last poll but since then it’s got worse and I don’t think there’s any excuses for the manager anymore.

How many of these problem are his own creation though? The midfield is his issue as is the attack he/the club seems reluctant to let players go. VDB, Lingard, Martial, Mata should all have left the club in the summer but he didn’t want to let any go.

Neville and Carragher just did a great bit of analysis on them and where they are right now neither called for him to be sacked but both agree he’s got big problems, pressure is growing and carragher wasn’t afraid to say he’s not a world class manager and that he won’t win a league as Utd manager.

Yeah I get that about the wording mate, it was more in response to 'nonsense' which was a like a red rag to this erm Red Rag.

The midfield is a problem and I don't envy Ole having to sort it, and we'll know at the end of the season if his reluctant to let certain players go is/was a mistake, they might all have a massive part to play at the business end of the season if injuries kick in.

Wouldn't expect an Everton supporting ex-Liverpool player to say different. Up to Ole to prove him wrong.
 

Cosmic Slop

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@Justin Cider

Think the swing in the poll was the way the question is asked it’s yes or no you can’t sit on the fence last time it was asked it was far to early to sack him and it probably still is but what it highlights is how quickly people are losing faith. I voted no in the last poll but since then it’s got worse and I don’t think there’s any excuses for the manager anymore.

How many of these problem are his own creation though? The midfield is his issue as is the attack he/the club seems reluctant to let players go. VDB, Lingard, Martial, Mata should all have left the club in the summer but he didn’t want to let any go.

Neville and Carragher just did a great bit of analysis on them and where they are right now neither called for him to be sacked but both agree he’s got big problems, pressure is growing and carragher wasn’t afraid to say he’s not a world class manager and that he won’t win a league as Utd manager.
I agree with Neville usually but Carragher is such a blinkered fool it's hard to take him seriously (when you can even understand what he's saying). Carragher can say Ole will never win the league with United but plenty of "great" managers came and went through Liverpool without winning one either. Benitez, Rodgers, Hodgson, Houllier, in recent memory are more qualified managers than Ole and didn't win the league, so what's his point? He doesn't have one. He's a dirty scouse bastard who spits at little girls.
 

jsp

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I agree with Neville usually but Carragher is such a blinkered fool it's hard to take him seriously (when you can even understand what he's saying). Carragher can say Ole will never win the league with United but plenty of "great" managers came and went through Liverpool without winning one either. Benitez, Rodgers, Hodgson, Houllier, in recent memory are more qualified managers than Ole and didn't win the league, so what's his point? He doesn't have one. He's a dirty scouse bastard who spits at little girls.

Carragher was very respectful to Ole he said he’s done a great job but he’s reached his limit like many Liverpool managers they tried and failed to beat Fergie’s Utd. Ole is up against 3 top managers with 3 quality squads Utd now have a great squad but they don’t have a great manager. Those managers you listed I can think of 1 season where Liverpool had a squad capable of challenging us with those managers 08/09 with Benitez they had a brilliant side but so did we and we also had Fergie who was a better manager.

Utd didn’t have the best team every time Fergie won the league but we had the best manager who knew the best way to get every last drop out of his squad and he’d find a way to win football matches that would suck the life out of our opponents.

He might be a scouser but he knows the game and he talks a lot more sense than Neville a lot of the time when it comes to Utd as he’s not afraid to slag off the manager or players. Neville can’t go there because of who he is.
 

nonewname

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No he shouldnt be sacked now so i voted no
Not because he will turn things around,he wont, hes shown that over the last 2 seasons
But because there is no excellent quality replacement
Sorry but Zidane Conte Rodgers and Potter are not the answer
 

Justin Cider

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Not sure what, apart from that 4 out of 5 that voted are entitled, what the poll proves.

Apologies if it was just for giggles.
 

Macariman

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A wild 1 perhaps. OGS won't be there at the end of this season, he's already shown that.
Who will, we've all heard the usual suspects waiting in the wings.
But there's 1 candidate that I haven't heard mentioned.
It would be a totally long call, a real left winger, but i would strongly suggest we already have the man in camp.
We don't have a real captain on the field, nor club captain of MUFC, as it stands
We have got to change in an immeasurable level.
CR taking over both on and off the field ,
Utd at heart, he will earn all respect of every man who pulls on that shirt and who will only win. It's all he knows
Thoughts on it gentlemen?
 

O-Dog

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What makes you think Ronaldo has the interpersonal skills or management nous to be successful? Has he got his coaching badges?

I think he'd need to learn his manager lines on a smaller stage.
 

RichH2016

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Not sure what, apart from that 4 out of 5 that voted are entitled, what the poll proves.

Apologies if it was just for giggles.
Haha entitled? Come on now. Fans want to see better. United have a squad that should contend for major silverware and they won't with the current manager. Isn't winning the point of sport?
 

Mr C

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Chelsea and city putting the pressure on United yesterday.
Need to win. How on earth did Villa and Everton get points from us
 

Justin Cider

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Haha entitled? Come on now. Fans want to see better. United have a squad that should contend for major silverware and they won't with the current manager. Isn't winning the point of sport?

Yeah entitled, do you not think I want the team to be better, more consistent?

After finishing 2nd in the League and getting to a major European final last season let's at least give the improved squad half a season to click before we decide whether they are good enough to take the club the next step, and not decide after a few dodgy results in a month we traditionally do poorly, that we won't.

No patience some fans, simple as.

And competing is the point of sport surely, unless you think everybody can win.
 

Justin Cider

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I'm totally crap when it comes to %'s so is there any chance we can have the poll open again say until midnight after the Spurs game so I can learn what 14 out of 15 is as a %

Guessing it'll be a lot higher than 80% but then i'm struggling. Wish i'd paid attention at skool.

Edit: Thanks google.

100 x 14 ÷ 15 = 93.33*
 

Macariman

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Yeah entitled, do you not think I want the team to be better, more consistent?

After finishing 2nd in the League and getting to a major European final last season let's at least give the improved squad half a season to click before we decide whether they are good enough to take the club the next step, and not decide after a few dodgy results in a month we traditionally do poorly, that we won't.

No patience some fans, simple as.

And competing is the point of sport surely, unless you think everybody can win.
Finishing absolutely nowhere near the League winners last season. Beaten in the final of the Euro Mickey Mouse cup by the mighty powerhouse that is, feck, can't remember who they are?
Patience is a virtue bro, which u obviously mass produce out the back in the garden shed!
 

Justin Cider

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Finishing absolutely nowhere near the League winners last season. Beaten in the final of the Euro Mickey Mouse cup by the mighty powerhouse that is, feck, can't remember who they are?
Patience is a virtue bro, which u obviously mass produce out the back in the garden shed!

We finished a damn sight closer to City than Liverpool and Chelsea though, you know those teams whose level we are trying to reach.

You are aware how p*ss poor our results are against Spanish opposition over the years aren't you, so disappointing as it was it really wasn't a surprise, though I doubt those that thought it's only friggin Villarreal would agree.

Think we can all agree though that if we'd had Paddy Roche or a traffic cone in goals we'd have won on pens.

Don't have a garden, and there's not enough room in me yard for a shed.
 

jsp

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We finished a damn sight closer to City than Liverpool and Chelsea though, you know those teams whose level we are trying to reach.

You are aware how p*ss poor our results are against Spanish opposition over the years aren't you, so disappointing as it was it really wasn't a surprise, though I doubt those that thought it's only friggin Villarreal would agree.

Think we can all agree though that if we'd had Paddy Roche or a traffic cone in goals we'd have won on pens.

Don't have a garden, and there's not enough room in me yard for a shed.

Chelsea sacked their manager and won the European cup
Liverpool suffered a massive injury crisis which killed them in the middle of the season.

Utd didn’t beat either side in the league last season if I recall correctly 3 draws and 1 defeat against those 2.

I dare say IF Chelsea had Tuchel all season or Liverpool had avoided those injuries either of them win that title as City I don’t think were that great last season yet we still couldn’t get within 10 points of them.

Utd just haven’t moved forward I don’t think we looked great second half of last season and that drifted into this season and it’s sadly all collapsing like a house of cards.
 

Berba_God

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I think our second place last season was more a reflection on the teams around us as opposed to our own doing. Those matters have been resolved for those teams and we simply can’t compete.
 

jsp

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74 points in previous seasons would get you

3rd - 25 points off 1st (Liverpool)
3rd - 24 points off 1st (City)
4th - 26 points off 1st (City)
6th - 19 points off 1st (Chelsea)
2nd - 7 points off 1st (Leicester)

Think everyone agreed after last season Utd needed to add another 10 points to that total to be in a title race as it stands we are heading towards 59 points.

Chelsea who are top are heading towards 93 points.

Still a bit early to be using average points per game to be projecting totals but it shows you how quickly you can fall behind. Even if Utd win the next 2 games based on that average you’d be heading towards 70 points.
 

RichH2016

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So apparently he's staying for now... Despite some players having reservations. In other words whether it's now or a few weeks or a few months it is now inevitable. Unless they go on some crazy good run (which they could and have done under Ole in the past) then with every loss and draw to teams they should beat the reservations will grow.
 

Justin Cider

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Chelsea sacked their manager and won the European cup
Liverpool suffered a massive injury crisis which killed them in the middle of the season.

Utd didn’t beat either side in the league last season if I recall correctly 3 draws and 1 defeat against those 2.

I dare say IF Chelsea had Tuchel all season or Liverpool had avoided those injuries either of them win that title as City I don’t think were that great last season yet we still couldn’t get within 10 points of them.

Utd just haven’t moved forward I don’t think we looked great second half of last season and that drifted into this season and it’s sadly all collapsing like a house of cards.

Not sure you can compare United and Chelsea as clubs to be honest, how many times do we hear a player just can't hack playing for Manchester United(which isn't a criticism), or can't hack playing for England, then how many times do we hear a player just couldn't hack it playing for Chelsea, it just doesn't happen, so there's less hit and miss with new recruits for starters making it easier to bring the right players in to improve the team instantly, and that's before you factor in the 592 players they've got out on loan at a good level all ready to take their chance if they can't get the player(s)they want - Chelsea got lucky with Tuchel, it may well have gone the other way, and just because it worked at Chelsea doesn't mean it would work at United.

I don't think the injuries played that big a part for Liverpool last season, they still had the midfield which makes their team tick, and still had the feared three up top, they were just found out, and it's to their credit that they've ironed out any issues and are up and running(literally)again this season - thought it was cute how many in the media defended them over their injuries, yet conveniently turned a blind eye when United went nearly three years and having 8/9 out was the norm and at times it was in double figures, but then they always have been the medias darling.

Fair enough on the 2nd half of last season, but we don't know if we'd not been still in the Europa League it would have been the same, it was a brutal season fixture wise and the team did well with a smallish squad to keep going in both comps for me.

Tiss a mystery what's happened this season after a good start, and I don't believe a new Manager is suddenly gonna turn it around, not until he or she move on those that have far too much sway in the dressing-room, and I think most of us know who they are.
 

Justin Cider

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So apparently he's staying for now... Despite some players having reservations. In other words whether it's now or a few weeks or a few months it is now inevitable. Unless they go on some crazy good run (which they could and have done under Ole in the past) then with every loss and draw to teams they should beat the reservations will grow.

Were you really expecting different?
 

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