Ruben Amorim

[jsp]

It is a very poorly assembled squad. No matter how you organise the pieces it always looks short of goals and lacks a physical presence. As every other team got bigger and stronger we got smaller and weaker.

Dorgu is going to need to be some player to fix this mess.

It’s a squad that is now on its 3rd revision of the Utd plan. It was started by Ole, Ten Hag ripped that up and now Amorim is ripping that up.

Zero continuity of ideas and vision has left us with a complete clusterf*ck of players.

I do feel sorry for Amorim as he’s basically ended January with a weaker squad than he started with.

I do take a little bit of confidence that it feels like Utd can now get sensible deals done both in and out. If we can keep that up over time things should improve but this is going to be a long process.

I just hope we’ve kind of hit the bottom now and it doesn’t sink any lower.

 

[Matt Varnish]

It is a very poorly assembled squad. No matter how you organise the pieces it always looks short of goals and lacks a physical presence. As every other team got bigger and stronger we got smaller and weaker.

Dorgu is going to need to be some player to fix this mess.

It’s a squad that is now on its 3rd revision of the Utd plan. It was started by Ole, Ten Hag ripped that up and now Amorim is ripping that up.

Zero continuity of ideas and vision has left us with a complete clusterf*ck of players.

I do feel sorry for Amorim as he’s basically ended January with a weaker squad than he started with.

I do take a little bit of confidence that it feels like Utd can now get sensible deals done both in and out. If we can keep that up over time things should improve but this is going to be a long process.

I just hope we’ve kind of hit the bottom now and it doesn’t sink any lower.

History repeats itself, this is practically what happened pre Fergie, it's almost a duplicate, even down to the former player being a manager, Fergie had similar problems when he took over, and relied heavily on the academy to see him through.

 

[croady26]

Forced here early despite not having any money to buy players, wouldn't blame him walking

 

[SuperRash]

It’s sad to see the state of our squad after having so much promising talent on our books.

Rashford and Martial should have grown into top top class players but for one reason and another neither have really kicked on to the heights their talent suggested. Then there is Greenwood. Sancho never showed anything like his form at Dortmund and Pogba should have been absolute gold and would be well into his prime now!

Quite a rebuild we have on our hands (again!).

 

[Mr C]

they've had owners who don't care about football or trophies and it's filtered down.

 

[Matt Varnish]

It’s sad to see the state of our squad after having so much promising talent on our books.

Rashford and Martial should have grown into top top class players but for one reason and another neither have really kicked on to the heights their talent suggested. Then there is Greenwood. Sancho never showed anything like his form at Dortmund and Pogba should have been absolute gold and would be well into his prime now!

Quite a rebuild we have on our hands (again!).

Whilst most players peak in their late twenties, and goalkeepers even later, there is also evidence that some players reach a standard and can never surpass that.
Rashford is not on his own, neither is Sancho, Deli Ali never kicked on after a great apprenticeship, the same can be said of Sterling, Ian Wrights son what was his name Wright Philips,? never it the heights he showed promise to achieve.
So why are we surprised Rashfords has had a few good seasons, and suddenly defenders have the measure of him?

 

[croady26]

It’s sad to see the state of our squad after having so much promising talent on our books.

Rashford and Martial should have grown into top top class players but for one reason and another neither have really kicked on to the heights their talent suggested. Then there is Greenwood. Sancho never showed anything like his form at Dortmund and Pogba should have been absolute gold and would be well into his prime now!

Quite a rebuild we have on our hands (again!).

The minute Rashford gave that interview we should have been sourcing out loan replacement ready for January but didn't bother. I saw someone best described our efforts at replacing him as half arsed overtures which is bang on.

 

[jsp]

The big issue I see is within the squad there is now zero legacy of the "glory days" all that experience and knowledge of how to win the title in this country is now long gone so there are not many people in that club right now who know what it takes to win this league. The good habits can no longer be passed down and that passing down of good habits really stopped under LVG when most of the Fergie era squad departed over the space of 2-3 summers. I think we have lost a lot of what it means to be a Man Utd player and how you handle that pressure and responsibility.

I do think in the summer we have to think about buying some players from other premier league clubs we can't keep going abroad and having to allow time to adapt. I'm struggling to think of to many players in the last 5 years who've come in from other premier league sides.

This obviously comes at a premium but I think in the case of 1 or 2 of the signings this summer it'll be a premium worth paying as we need players who are going to be ready to go.

Signing young players is always risky as there development isn't guaranteed and we've shown pretty consistently over the last decade that this club is not a good place for a young player to succeed in fulfilling their potential. The list of talented players in their teens or early 20's who came to the club and didn't improve is astonishing really. I think this squad need a couple of good 23-28 year olds that can really be the reliable performers for Amorim.

The biggest thing that has to change is the culture you don't come to Man Utd for a pay day you come here to win. Utd of course will always pay well but the message has to be deliver on the pitch for Utd then you'll be rewarded we have got to stop giving the reward up front. The top 5 earners at Man Utd going forward should never be new signings the players on the big wedge should be those who've come to the club, delivered on the pitch and been rewarded with better contracts.

Cultures aren't changed over night though and Amorim has made it clear he won't tolerate any chancers who aren't fully committed to the cause regardless of their ability.

Alongside this culture change there obviously is the need for a massive improvement of the quality in that squad especially in the attacking areas there has got to be some serious money spent on fixing those problems and any thing that comes through the academy should be seen as a bonus.

Worry is I'm not sure we've got the money to actually do it.

 

[RaimondVanDeGouw]

It’s almost the same as when ETH came in. The squad was poor then and ETH needed time to implement his system and to have his own players that compliment the system and three seasons in and nobody really had a clue what he was trying to do, his signings were, nearly all, awful and we are now further down a spiral than we were when ETH came in. The same calls are being made now that Amorim’s system needs time and he needs his own players.

The difference so far is that ETH’s United lost three games in the league prior to Christmas in his first season, we got to the cup final and won the League Cup. His first season yielded results. I appreciate that they come in at very different times but right now, three home league wins this season under Amorim would be a success given how we’ve played and the results under him so far, in which we’ve even managed to limp past a really poor Southampton team. There will be some that say that regardless what happens between now and the end of this season, it doesn’t matter but a poor start next season and I think the vultures begin to circle very quickly, especially within the media and at Sky. Questions then will likely get raised whether you continue on the vicious cycle and whether continuing to back Amorim, and letting him bring in new players that suit a system that really doesn’t look like working or becoming more comfortable for all bar maybe 3-4 players, is actually worth it.

 

[croady26]

It’s sad to see the state of our squad after having so much promising talent on our books.

Rashford and Martial should have grown into top top class players but for one reason and another neither have really kicked on to the heights their talent suggested. Then there is Greenwood. Sancho never showed anything like his form at Dortmund and Pogba should have been absolute gold and would be well into his prime now!

Quite a rebuild we have on our hands (again!).

Greenwood is the saddest of the lot

The big issue I see is within the squad there is now zero legacy of the "glory days" all that experience and knowledge of how to win the title in this country is now long gone so there are not many people in that club right now who know what it takes to win this league. The good habits can no longer be passed down and that passing down of good habits really stopped under LVG when most of the Fergie era squad departed over the space of 2-3 summers. I think we have lost a lot of what it means to be a Man Utd player and how you handle that pressure and responsibility.

I do think in the summer we have to think about buying some players from other premier league clubs we can't keep going abroad and having to allow time to adapt. I'm struggling to think of to many players in the last 5 years who've come in from other premier league sides.

This obviously comes at a premium but I think in the case of 1 or 2 of the signings this summer it'll be a premium worth paying as we need players who are going to be ready to go.

Signing young players is always risky as there development isn't guaranteed and we've shown pretty consistently over the last decade that this club is not a good place for a young player to succeed in fulfilling their potential. The list of talented players in their teens or early 20's who came to the club and didn't improve is astonishing really. I think this squad need a couple of good 23-28 year olds that can really be the reliable performers for Amorim.

The biggest thing that has to change is the culture you don't come to Man Utd for a pay day you come here to win. Utd of course will always pay well but the message has to be deliver on the pitch for Utd then you'll be rewarded we have got to stop giving the reward up front. The top 5 earners at Man Utd going forward should never be new signings the players on the big wedge should be those who've come to the club, delivered on the pitch and been rewarded with better contracts.

Cultures aren't changed over night though and Amorim has made it clear he won't tolerate any chancers who aren't fully committed to the cause regardless of their ability.

Alongside this culture change there obviously is the need for a massive improvement of the quality in that squad especially in the attacking areas there has got to be some serious money spent on fixing those problems and any thing that comes through the academy should be seen as a bonus.

Worry is I'm not sure we've got the money to actually do it.

Which PL players should we be looking at?

 

[jsp]

Which PL players should we be looking at?

I don’t watch anywhere near enough PL games so from the limited bits I’ve seen these players have caught my eye from teams in the bottom half.. I don’t think you’ll get players from CL clubs.

Ipswich - Delap, Hutchinson and the left back who’s name escapes me look interesting.

Southampton - Dibley and Walker-Peters

Brentford - Mbeumo or Wissa

Brighton - Baleba, Mitoma and Welbeck for some experience in attack.

Bournemouth - Kirkez, Huijsen, Christie, Outarra, Semenyo.

Palace - Guehi, Mitchell, Wharton, Mateta, Eze

Wolves - ait nouri, Cunha, Joao Gomes.

Fulham - Robinson, Lucic and Jiminez.

West Ham - Bowen and Kudus

A few of those sides play a back 3 and wing back system so that’s where I’d be looking first. Can we poach the best player from those teams that slot straight in where we need help.

A big thing I want to see is this Utd side get bigger, quicker and stronger. We have to stop getting bullied off the park every week

 

[RaimondVanDeGouw]

I don’t watch anywhere near enough PL games so from the limited bits I’ve seen these players have caught my eye from teams in the bottom half.. I don’t think you’ll get players from CL clubs.

Ipswich - Delap, Hutchinson and the left back who’s name escapes me look interesting.

Southampton - Dibley and Walker-Peters

Brentford - Mbeumo or Wissa

Brighton - Baleba, Mitoma and Welbeck for some experience in attack.

Bournemouth - Kirkez, Huijsen, Christie, Outarra, Semenyo.

Palace - Guehi, Mitchell, Wharton, Mateta, Eze

Wolves - ait nouri, Cunha, Joao Gomes.

Fulham - Robinson, Lucic and Jiminez.

West Ham - Bowen and Kudus

A few of those sides play a back 3 and wing back system so that’s where I’d be looking first. Can we poach the best player from those teams that slot straight in where we need help.

A big thing I want to see is this Utd side get bigger, quicker and stronger. We have to stop getting bullied off the park every week

When you’ve got teams like Palace rejecting £70m for players, you can’t really expect us to be going for some of those names. Gone are the days where you could pick off your Carrick’s and Saha’s from lesser clubs. Clubs don’t need to sell as much anymore given the money in the game and you’re probably looking at £1b worth of players from those you’ve listed.

 

[jsp]

When you’ve got teams like Palace rejecting £70m for players, you can’t really expect us to be going for some of those names. Gone are the days where you could pick off your Carrick’s and Saha’s from lesser clubs. Clubs don’t need to sell as much anymore given the money in the game and you’re probably looking at £1b worth of players from those you’ve listed.

Guehi is top end of the scale as he’s an England international. I personally don’t see a point in us spending 70m on him

Few of those I reckon you can get for between £30-50m which is what we are paying for similar lads from other leagues. A few will be on expiring contracts which brings the price down.

I’d just like to see 1 or 2 of the guys that come in this summer be players already in the prem. It will cost a little bit more money on a transfer fee but it should also remove a little bit of the risk.

 

[IDFD]

Some one 37yrs of age saying that is quite ludicrous. When Ferguson was manager for 26 of those 40yrs.
That is the problem with fans in the their late thirties and early forties, all they remember is Ferguson, there was a Manchester Untied before then, and it was pretty dire at times.
You didn't have to witness the likes of Dave Sexton & Frank O'Farrell

Hence me saying 40 years. I don't know anything prior to Fergie.

Be stupid for me to say he's the worst manager of the last hundred years when I didn't witness it. That would be ludicrous to me to say. What i said was factually correct.

Was more a point of he's the worst manager post Fergie currently. We have won 4 of 13 league games under him. Ragnick was performing better that's how bad it's been.

 

[Matt Varnish]

Hence me saying 40 years. I don't know anything prior to Fergie.

Be stupid for me to say he's the worst manager of the last hundred years when I didn't witness it. That would be ludicrous to me to say. What i said was factually correct.

Was more a point of he's the worst manager post Fergie currently. We have won 4 of 13 league games under him. Ragnick was performing better that's how bad it's been.

So basically you are saying that you know nothing about the history of United, including former owners and managers.
You need to check your facts, Ragnick had a win percentage of around 34%, Amorim at present is on 42%.
ETH left the club on 54% after 158 games, Amorim has had 19 to date.

Your dislike for Amorim and twisted "facts" are very evident that you still hanker after a manager who's trend was down, had a penchant for Dutch players, and created many of the issues Amorim is facing.
Given that and the board allowing, I will save judgement on him until he had the same amount of time, and the chance to build the team he wants.

 

[IDFD]

You might want to check those league percentages.

Best Win Percentage Of All Manchester United Managers | StatMuse

Alex Ferguson has the best winning percentage by a Man United manager in the Premier League, winning 65.2 percent of the time.

www.statmuse.com

And stop with the stupid arrogant stance. My post was and is factually correct. I stated 4 of 13. Making it evident I was talking about the league which is the only fair comparison of all.

He's factually the worst premier league manager we've ever had. As stated and you stupidly arguing against.

Facts fecking checked.

 

[Matt Varnish]

You might want to check those league percentages.

Best Win Percentage Of All Manchester United Managers | StatMuse

Alex Ferguson has the best winning percentage by a Man United manager in the Premier League, winning 65.2 percent of the time.

www.statmuse.com

And stop with the stupid arrogant stance. My post was and is factually correct. I stated 4 of 13. Making it evident I was talking about the league which is the only fair comparison of all.

He's factually the worst premier league manager we've ever had. As stated and you stupidly arguing against.

Facts fecking checked.

No you are not, you are twisting the facts to suit your narrative, and you've been found out, Ragnicks win percentage includes all games, so why shouldn't Amorims?
Even if you compare the two on league wins only, ETH's is inflated by his first season a fairer comparison would be his last fourteen games in charge, where are we then?
I shall tell you, if you include ALL competitions including the Charity Shield his win percentage for 2024-25 is 30.77% over 10% BELOW Amorim.
If you take just his League results Played 9 Won 3 Drawn 2 Lost 4, you still end up with a win percentage of just over 30%, so your "facts" are wrong.
Complete stats

Erik ten Hag Stats - Manchester United Manager | FootyStats

Erik ten Hag is the manager of Manchester United FC and their season win percentage is 33%. Erik ten Hag has managed 9 matches this season in the Premier League in England...

footystats.org

 

[croady26]

I don’t watch anywhere near enough PL games so from the limited bits I’ve seen these players have caught my eye from teams in the bottom half.. I don’t think you’ll get players from CL clubs.

Ipswich - Delap, Hutchinson and the left back who’s name escapes me look interesting.

Southampton - Dibley and Walker-Peters

Brentford - Mbeumo or Wissa

Brighton - Baleba, Mitoma and Welbeck for some experience in attack.

Bournemouth - Kirkez, Huijsen, Christie, Outarra, Semenyo.

Palace - Guehi, Mitchell, Wharton, Mateta, Eze

Wolves - ait nouri, Cunha, Joao Gomes.

Fulham - Robinson, Lucic and Jiminez.

West Ham - Bowen and Kudus

A few of those sides play a back 3 and wing back system so that’s where I’d be looking first. Can we poach the best player from those teams that slot straight in where we need help.

A big thing I want to see is this Utd side get bigger, quicker and stronger. We have to stop getting bullied off the park every week

Ipswich LB is Leif Davis, what about Fernandes at Southampton as well?

 

[jsp]

Ipswich LB is Leif Davis, what about Fernandes at Southampton as well?

Haven’t seen much of Southampton and in the games against us he didn’t really catch my eye.

 

[Matt Varnish]

I honestly don't think it's worth poaching players from other EPL teams, any that are decent are out of our price range, and we all know that when United come calling the price doubles, we all know that what we pay for a player is no guide to how good he is.
Amorim has to develop a scouting network, not just for players to slot in now, but for the academy as well, we need the network back that SAF had, the network Mourinhou did away with, it will take time.
We are lucky enough to have a young coach with ideals and morals, we have to back him at least for the same amount of time we backed ETH

 

[SuperRash]

I know poaching players from other EPL clubs is expensive business these days, I do think we have missed out on talent closer to home by going out into Europe. And we’ve overpaid then anyway!

From the list jsp put up I think there is so much potential there. Names to stand out I would say Dibling, Mbeumo and Huijsen are the three. Kirkez and Robinson would be on the list as well but with spending money on Dorgu I think those moves are unlikely.

 

[RH78]

It’s almost the same as when ETH came in. The squad was poor then and ETH needed time to implement his system and to have his own players that compliment the system and three seasons in and nobody really had a clue what he was trying to do, his signings were, nearly all, awful and we are now further down a spiral than we were when ETH came in. The same calls are being made now that Amorim’s system needs time and he needs his own players.

The difference so far is that ETH’s United lost three games in the league prior to Christmas in his first season, we got to the cup final and won the League Cup. His first season yielded results. I appreciate that they come in at very different times but right now, three home league wins this season under Amorim would be a success given how we’ve played and the results under him so far, in which we’ve even managed to limp past a really poor Southampton team. There will be some that say that regardless what happens between now and the end of this season, it doesn’t matter but a poor start next season and I think the vultures begin to circle very quickly, especially within the media and at Sky. Questions then will likely get raised whether you continue on the vicious cycle and whether continuing to back Amorim, and letting him bring in new players that suit a system that really doesn’t look like working or becoming more comfortable for all bar maybe 3-4 players, is actually worth it.

I have nothing against the signing of Dorgu but I can't help feeling he has been signed in a desperate attempt to help heal Amorims personal system rather than look at the bigger issues as in a complete lack of goals. We have covered the full back area ( perhaps not brilliantly)
but in my opinion the striking area is an absolute disgrace and should have been addressed even with a short term/loan signing

 

[IDFD]

No you are not, you are twisting the facts to suit your narrative, and you've been found out, Ragnicks win percentage includes all games, so why shouldn't Amorims?
Even if you compare the two on league wins only, ETH's is inflated by his first season a fairer comparison would be his last fourteen games in charge, where are we then?
I shall tell you, if you include ALL competitions including the Charity Shield his win percentage for 2024-25 is 30.77% over 10% BELOW Amorim.
If you take just his League results Played 9 Won 3 Drawn 2 Lost 4, you still end up with a win percentage of just over 30%, so your "facts" are wrong.
Complete stats

Erik ten Hag Stats - Manchester United Manager | FootyStats

Erik ten Hag is the manager of Manchester United FC and their season win percentage is 33%. Erik ten Hag has managed 9 matches this season in the Premier League in England...

footystats.org

ETH league win percentage for just this season is 33%. Amorim is at 30%.

You really aren't good at this fact thing.

Ragnicks win percentage and everyone's win percentage i included is just league games. It really isn't a difficult stat to read. Manchester United managers premier league win percentage. It's that simple. Amorim comes bottom of the category.

It's unfair to include ETH first season because he done well. You realise Amorim is allowed to do the same thing ETH did and adapt?

The problem is this season we were missing chances. The performances were there but the idiots couldn't see the missed chances are what were costing us not the manager. And now it's back to both.

Only not quite back to both. We no longer create the chances to miss.

Unlike most on this forum. I dont criticise managers lightly. But it's beyond laughable for anyone to suggest Amorim is a better manager than ETH. There is nothing factual to back it up in either of their careers.

It's been a car crash. As expected.

 

[croady26]

I have nothing against the signing of Dorgu but I can't help feeling he has been signed in a desperate attempt to help heal Amorims personal system rather than look at the bigger issues as in a complete lack of goals. We have covered the full back area ( perhaps not brilliantly)
but in my opinion the striking area is an absolute disgrace and should have been addressed even with a short term/loan signing

Wish we could have got him a loan too

 

[Sideshow Bob]

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[Matt Varnish]

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Then there is Richard Keys (yes that Richard Keys) handing out clickbait on Football 365 that Amorim is ready to, or is about to quit because he has realised he is not up to the jo0b at United.
There should be law stopping idiots like him being in the media again.

 

[Sideshow Bob]

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[O-Dog]

I like that he takes ownership of all the issues. I like his honesty. I like that he has a clear philosophy of how the game should be played.

Whether it works or not, who knows? He gives me confidence, though.

 

[Mr C]

I like that he takes ownership of all the issues. I like his honesty. I like that he has a clear philosophy of how the game should be played.

Whether it works or not, who knows? He gives me confidence, though.

same

 

[jsp]

I do think his communication skills are miles ahead of ETH and he certainly makes you want to believe which I do feel is half the battle sometimes.

This is a risky strategy but without admitting it they're basically saying this season is being written off the manager is going to have to go without the tools he needs for the rest of the season.

What needs to happen though is we need to see the pay off in the summer the club have got to be right on it from day one in the transfer window getting the new players in early so that next season we can hit the ground running and aren't waiting until the end of the window to get all our deals done.

 

[Matt Varnish]

I do think his communication skills are miles ahead of ETH and he certainly makes you want to believe which I do feel is half the battle sometimes.

This is a risky strategy but without admitting it they're basically saying this season is being written off the manager is going to have to go without the tools he needs for the rest of the season.

What needs to happen though is we need to see the pay off in the summer the club have got to be right on it from day one in the transfer window getting the new players in early so that next season we can hit the ground running and aren't waiting until the end of the window to get all our deals done.

I would hope that the powers that be are already identifying targets for the summer, and that Amorim has sat down with them to say who he wants in, who he wants to keep, and who he wants out, there has to be a plan, knee jerk reactions are what got us into this mess.

 

[jsp]

I would hope that the powers that be are already identifying targets for the summer, and that Amorim has sat down with them to say who he wants in, who he wants to keep, and who he wants out, there has to be a plan, knee jerk reactions are what got us into this mess.

Yeah I'm hoping the panic buys have stopped and there's much better discipline around the club now to stop the real bad ones like Sanchez, Ronaldo, Casemiro and Antony from happening again.

I suspect he's got a pretty good idea and the idea can't just be go and spend a fortune on a load of Sporting players. There's talk of one of their younger players coming in Quenda but I don't think they'll go back for Gyokeres.

Big challenge for him is the same one all the other managers faced which is getting the ones you want out to actually leave.

There's a big old list of players he'll need for that squad maybe a season out of Europe where you can trim the squad a bit might be a good thing for him from a coaching point of view but it means there's an even smaller budget to work with.

 

[IDFD]

Yeah I'm hoping the panic buys have stopped and there's much better discipline around the club now to stop the real bad ones like Sanchez, Ronaldo, Casemiro and Antony from happening again.

That's with hindsight. At the time Ronaldo, Sanchez and Casemiro were good signings. Sanchez especially no one could have foreseen that going wrong. He was in the form of his life coming from a premier league club.

Antony and Fellaini style purchases are the ones we need to stop. Paying over the odds last minute when we could have had them for half the cost 2 weeks previously.

 

[SuperRash]

That's with hindsight. At the time Ronaldo, Sanchez and Casemiro were good signings. Sanchez especially no one could have foreseen that going wrong. He was in the form of his life coming from a premier league club.

Antony and Fellaini style purchases are the ones we need to stop. Paying over the odds last minute when we could have had them for half the cost 2 weeks previously.

I will give you the Sanchez one but less so Ronaldo and Casemiro.

The Ronaldo was good for the footballing romantics out there but was always going to end in tears for me. Still scored a good portion of goals for us but his arrogance, obscene weekly wage and him being on the decline was a recipe for disaster.

Casemiro had a very good first season but it wasn’t wise spending that much money on someone who would probably need replacing in a couple of years. As it turns out the decline was quicker than expected.

 

[jsp]

That's with hindsight. At the time Ronaldo, Sanchez and Casemiro were good signings. Sanchez especially no one could have foreseen that going wrong. He was in the form of his life coming from a premier league club.

Antony and Fellaini style purchases are the ones we need to stop. Paying over the odds last minute when we could have had them for half the cost 2 weeks previously.

I dunno there were plenty of people that had reservations about those signings given the fee/wages but it's hard not to be excited when players like that join but all of them had massive red flags that the club ignored and sunk big money into bringing them in.

Anthony to me is a stand out one it was full panic mode that one really annoys me because if we had that sort of money available it needed to be spent in the summer not in the last few days of the window. We could have got so much more than we ended up getting with him.

I do hope they have learned to walk away from bad deals and January makes me think they have the old Utd would have paniced and spent money they don't really have on a loan deal for Tel or someone similar.