Premier League 2023/24: Man United vs Arsenal - Sun 12th May - 16:30 KO

SuperRash said:
I think if we brought in 4 players of the right quality then we can be challenging for top four and honours for sure. It just highly depends on the recruitment which has been shocking the last few years. But hopefully under a new structure we can finally get it right.

I think a centre back, two central midfielders and another striker and we are well on our way.
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Forget I'm a fan a Rashford,

So for you, Antony, Rashford, AWB, Shaw, 3 of our current 4 CB's this lot get top 4? All getting regular football, we get top 4. With this manager?

What are you doing with Mount? Casemiro is going nowhere. 2 more CM is daft, especially as Mainoo is nailed on.
 
Mr C said:
Assuming most of this lot are still here, you think these players, under this manager, are going to challenge for top 4?

I just can't see it. His system, with these players, is not working
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No my point was without the injuries I think this squad could have got top 4 this season.

Next season is a different story with what we know now things have to change, there are a number of players who we simply cannot rely on again next season for obvious reasons as age has caught up to quite a few of them.

The system thing I find a really tough one to judge him on as his "system" this season has had to change to suit the injuries. We've never really seen what the "perfect" team looks like. Maybe a handful of a games this season where we've had 9 of the best 11 on the pitch together.

Nothing ever gets bedded in because just as things looked to be settling down injury wise in January we get hit by another wave and we've basically been playing with 1 fit centre back for the last 6 weeks. The obvious response to this injury crisis would be ditch the system and just defend deep and counter instead he's said no stick with the system and accept results may suffer.

No-ones system is going to handle that sort of disruption just look at Liverpool the season after they won the league, their defenders got injured and they went from winning the league by 20 points to scraping into the top 4 on the last day. Last season a similar thing happened their midfielders all hit the wall physically in the same season and they ended up 5th after finishing 2nd and reaching 3 cup finals the season before.
 
I don't think Shaw and Martinez make that much difference, we've been poor since the first game.
 
JammyRed said:
You are the one needing help you are totally deluded, just putting your daft comments into context is enough for me.
The three nil win for Utd was your best yet..
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United score first, the crowd gets pumped, Arsenal with a shocking recent history at United knowing they can't afford to lose as they'd hand City the League go for it, we sit back and pick them off on the break, 3-0, good night Vieira!

Teams that collapse late on chasing Leagues don't just get beat 1-0 in must win games, they generally get battered, and if you had any football intelligence you'd know that.

Now jog on.
 
Justin Cider said:
Entirely on yesterday. Saliba, Odegaard, Rice and Saka walk into United's team. White as well probably.

They were there for the taking yesterday(because of that pressure), and with a fuller squad we'd have beaten them.
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Possibly, yes. I said near the start of the game they looked rattled. So I don't disagree.

I think as far as who gets in the squad, then for me it's Odegaard, Saka, Gabriel, Saliba and Rice. Trossard too on current form. He's been excellent recently. I watch a fair few Arsenal games and he's been a shrewd signing by Arteta.
 
Jayc1860 said:
Possibly, yes. I said near the start of the game they looked rattled. So I don't disagree.

I think as far as who gets in the squad, then for me it's Odegaard, Saka, Gabriel, Saliba and Rice. Trossard too on current form. He's been excellent recently. I watch a fair few Arsenal games and he's been a shrewd signing by Arteta.
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Not sure about Gabriel, being left-footed helps for balance, not sure he's a great defender though, but I always go for him in my FPL team over Saliba cos he's got a goal in him

Trossard is a weird one, people kept looking at him and thinking nah maybe not, think him being born 27/28 goes against him ....
 
Justin Cider said:
Not sure about Gabriel, being left-footed helps for balance, not sure he's a great defender though, but I always go for him in my FPL team over Saliba cos he's got a goal in him

Trossard is a weird one, people kept looking at him and thinking nah maybe not, think him being born 27/28 goes against him ....
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Well Trossard was the difference yesterday!

The pairing of Saliba and Gabriel is the best in the league, I think that's obvious. They walk into any team right now.
 
Justin Cider said:
United score first, the crowd gets pumped, Arsenal with a shocking recent history at United knowing they can't afford to lose as they'd hand City the League go for it, we sit back and pick them off on the break, 3-0, good night Vieira!

Teams that collapse late on chasing Leagues don't just get beat 1-0 in must win games, they generally get battered, and if you had any football intelligence you'd know that.

Now jog on.
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Great imagination you have there Mr score predictor, unfortunately it’s all fantasy.
To score you have to create chances then put them away, yesterday United managed two powderpuff shots that a five year old could have stopped.
Thats what happened not some fairy story that you thought happened.
Take your tablet put your straight jacket back on and go and sit in your corner.
 
Jayc1860 said:
Well Trossard was the difference yesterday!

The pairing of Saliba and Gabriel is the best in the league, I think that's obvious. They walk into any team right now.
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Was he, not like he scored the winning goal or anything ....

Not obvious if you only watch them against United.
 
JammyRed said:
Great imagination you have there Mr score predictor, unfortunately it’s all fantasy.
To score you have to create chances then put them away, yesterday United managed two powderpuff shots that a five year old could have stopped.
Thats what happened not some fairy story that you thought happened.
Take your tablet put your straight jacket back on and go and sit in your corner.
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Not rising to you, you're just an attention-seeking simpleton. Go on, go crying to the Mods ....

3-0 Hahaha
3-0 Hahaha
3-0 Hahaha
3-0 Hahaha
 
Mr C said:
I don't think Shaw and Martinez make that much difference, we've been poor since the first game.
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The performances and results were better in the periods where the two of them were fit which was only a brief period of time. Think Shaw was injured in the 2nd game of the season and Martinez I think lasted 5 games.

I just look back to the run from boxing day through to the middle of February and feel like something was starting to come together there. Then within the space of two games both of those players were injured again, Malacia had his set back, think Hojlund got injured again and the momentum was lost again.
 
JammyRed said:
“Maybe at your next counselling session”
You’ll find this comment if you bother to read through properly
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Stop playing the victim, if you hadn't posted #63 none of the recent comments would have happened. It's not rocket science.

Stop baiting ffs
 
Justin Cider said:
Think you're due a significant refund from the charm school, maybe buy yourself a nice little house ....
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Aw thanks, had your tablet yet?
This must be the third time you’ve promised to ignore/ not rise to me but here you are again Tattoo.
de plane de plane,
 
JammyRed said:
Aw thanks, had your tablet yet?
This must be the third time you’ve promised to ignore/ not rise to me but here you are again Tattoo.
de plane de plane,
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Don't recall ever saying I was gonna ignore you, but you hang on to your narrative sweetcheeks. Laterz
 
See the playground antics are back. Is it too much to ask to not continually snipe at each other in threads?
 
Mr C said:
Forget I'm a fan a Rashford,

So for you, Antony, Rashford, AWB, Shaw, 3 of our current 4 CB's this lot get top 4? All getting regular football, we get top 4. With this manager?

What are you doing with Mount? Casemiro is going nowhere. 2 more CM is daft, especially as Mainoo is nailed on.
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If you look on paper, our best eleven are more than good enough to get top four. Add 3 or 4 players on top of that then yeah of course we can get top four. ETH got it in his first season after all.

Onana

Dalot - SIGNING - Martinez - Shaw

Mainoo - SIGNING

Garnacho - Fernandes - SIGNING

Hojlund
​
I didn’t mentioned a winger in my summary of what we need but obviously Rashford’s figure has been questioned, so if we could someone like Kvaratskhelia from Napoli for example, then we should probably be all over it

Mount would be a back up for Bruno. And you would imagine Casemiro, Amrabat and Eriksen won’t be here next season, so would definitely need to bring in two midfielders. I would imagine Hannibal will probably be sold and Gore out on loan again.

With the addition of a few players, then there is no doubt we can get top four.
 
I've heard nothing but abuse for every single player, yet now all of a sudden they're capable of top four. What magic wand are you waving, or are you finally admitting the manager is the problem and not the team?

Dalot and Maguire was it, the only good players a few weeks ago?

You can't have it both ways.

And Mount couldn't play as a back up in the championship.

Where do the goals come from? Hojlund, who is a boy and can't even hold the ball up as of late?

You need a striker in there not removal of goals via getting rid of Rashford. Suicidal.
 
Every one of those current players in that team I listed are very good players in their own right but need some more quality around them. I’ve never said the manager isn’t the problem, of course he has a lot to do with it but equally it’s the players. It’s naive to just lump everything on the manager and not consider all factors. Also the majority of players have in my listed team did get top four.

Mount couldn’t play as back up in the Championship? He played as a starter in the Championship, so that’s just hyberpole. I’ve never particularly rated him that highly and wasn’t thrilled when we signed him but can at least recognise he’s a decent EPL player. Injuries have not been his friend though this season.

I’m not saying we don’t buy another striker but we aren’t going to spend another £60-70m on a striker when we bought Hojlund for the same amount. The money needs to be spent strategically and areas behind Hojlund are in need of a refresh.

It’s an absolutely lottery whether Rashford will suddenly turn up next season and score goals! You cannot go into any season relying on him to score goals because he’s been so inconsistent over the years. Obviously I like Rashford (hence my name) but the guy isn’t a kid anymore, he needs to add consistency to his game. You could argue he’s still raw and that’s not a good trait to have in your mid 20’s.
 
Oh, I don't disagree with you, I rate a lot of our players too. I feel the manager is the clear problem and has been for ages. I just wondered how a lot of people including yourself aimed a lot of blame at them, and used them as an excuse for ETH. Maybe, not so much now, but you definitely did. I remember reading your posts, always heavily in favour of the manager. No harm though, everyone gets it wrong from time to time!

Mount is horrendous, the sooner you all see it the better. It's like I predicted when he was signed. He'll go down as one of our worst signings ever. The guy has nothing, he's weak, doesn't seem to have any drive and can't even stay fit.

I agree on the investment, we do need to strengthen some other areas. Fact is though you can't win games without a striker, and that has to be one of the priorities, if not the first. The cost is meaningless, it has to happen.

I'd back Rashford in any sensible system, and even more so with the right manager.
 
I may have supported ETH but I probably had a good reason for it but I have been critical of the players when they’ve deserved it. I’ve always thought players get a hell of an easy ride from fans when things are going wrong. It’s very easy to point the blame at the manager. I don’t think ETH is particularly the man to lead us forward because it probably is time to have a fresh start on all fronts. However the criticism he does get isn’t always warranted. He can only do so much off the field but he’s not in charge of our players doing daft and baffling things on the pitch. He’s not a bad manager by any means.

I don’t think Mount can even be judged as a United player this season. He’s been injured time after time and even when he’s back he gets a few minutes here and there.

The cost is never meaningless in this day and age. You need to keep the books looking good for FFP. And you need to weigh up the areas of strengthening and for me defence and midfield need to be strengthened.

There is always a narrative of ‘oh this player will be better under a new manager’. That’s just a get out of jail free card for players and just punts the problem down the road for another manager.
 
Point is, have they ever deserved all the abuse and overly critical analysis during this season whilst playing in what I can only describe as an abomination of a system? Who's to blame for that? It's ETH and his stubborn ways. He has cost himself a player [sancho] as we've discussed... who do you think had to shoulder the extra blame for that? The squad of course. The pressure he has put himself under and the added pressure he's added to the players work load is idiotic. My argument is and always has been that all of these problems are self made, and the players get the grief for it.

With the cost of the player, I didn't mean absolutely meaningless, more that we should really push the boat out in that area, as it's important. It should be number one on your priority list if you expect top 4. A consistent goal scorer is 100% a must for that unless you have goals all over your attack, which we do not, especially if you are removing Rashford.

Mount played 24 games in the Prem 22/23 and only scored 3 goals and assisting twice. That is really bad. He's already lost about a third of his value, and it's just written all over him... he's not good enough to wash Bruno's kit.

As for him [Rashford] he's coming into his prime years, there can be no doubt he's about to explode. He showed signs of it last year, and has been derailed by a terrible manager this year. I think it's an easy spot.

On a positive note I think you did identify two of the areas we need to buy for. Centre-back and midfielder.
 
So you can hammer the manager but others can’t hammer the players?

The season has been a complete sh*t show pretty much from pre season all the way through to the end.

Everyone will take some flack for it and rightly so because let’s be honest it’s been embarrassing.

The board have essentially been replaced already so it’s up to them to review it and decide if the manager keeps or loses the job and the same goes for the players.

Let’s just hope that the new people in charge have the ability to fix the problem and dig us out of this mess.
 
jsp said:
Let’s just hope that the new people in charge have the ability to fix the problem and dig us out of this mess.
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That we can all agree on.
jsp said:
So you can hammer the manager but others can’t hammer the players?
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People can do as they wish, I just point to the source of all the problems is the manager and maybe the overly critical player analysis was a bit over the top. That's all.
 
Jayc1860 said:
That we can all agree on.

People can do as they wish, I just point to the source of all the problems is the manager and maybe the overly critical player analysis was a bit over the top. That's all.
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I just think some players make far to many individual errors that have nothing to do with the system which I can 100% agree is not working.

We have individual player threads to discuss these things so they’re going to highlight positives and negatives things they do. Most people are pretty good to dip into these threads with the positives just as much as the negatives.

Also, some of the players this season with their behaviour not just on the pitch but also off it have made them quite hard to like.
 
jsp said:
I just think some players make far to many individual errors that have nothing to do with the system which I can 100% agree is not working.

We have individual player threads to discuss these things so they’re going to highlight positives and negatives things they do. Most people are pretty good to dip into these threads with the positives just as much as the negatives.

Also, some of the players this season with their behaviour not just on the pitch but also off it have made them quite hard to like.
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I could simply argue all of these mistakes are due to this new system and a lack of understanding about how to use it effectively. The system is known for giving up possession a lot of the time too, which causes even more errors. To gain any confidence in a game you need some time on the ball to be calm. Our system just doesn't allow for this, and for me is a major reason we've failed to win a game with any real confidence all season.

Imagine being a player under these circumstances and you quickly realise why they all look so bad.
 

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