Jadon Sancho | Match Discussion thread 2022/23

I think with bad form you need a bit of credit in the bank Maguire had 2 years of good form which is why I was happy to give him time last season but ETH made the change and it's been proven to be a good decision. Maguire has now got a big challenge to get back in and to be honest it feels like it'll be an uphill battle and he probably leaves next summer.

It's not even game to game with Sancho it's half to half he has a spell in a match where he's almost unplayable then for the rest of the game he's invisible. There is still a settling in phase with all players but he's someone who needs to start showing more otherwise he'll find himself out of the picture.

He's a player who I just thinks lacks urgency you can't rely on him to be near his best every game which is what top players have to do.
 
Seems a shadow of the player who raced clear to score after robbing Jorginho in the same fixture last year. Appears short of confidence and misplaced several easy passes today, some of which were in our own third of the pitch. Needs taking out of the team and I would replace with Elanga.
 
RVN said:
Seems a shadow of the player who raced clear to score after robbing Jorginho in the same fixture last year. Appears short of confidence and misplaced several easy passes today, some of which were in our own third of the pitch. Needs taking out of the team and I would replace with Elanga.
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Slim pickings
 
Just doesn't look up for it which is strange when the team is playing so well you'd think he'd be buzzing to get on the pitch as there's goals to be had in this side.
 
I think we should keep playing him. He's a better option than Elanga and I think at Dortmund he used to pick up.

I imagine when Martial is fit he'll be the one to make way
 
Yep if Martial was fit he'd probably be the one who misses out.

ETH has to be careful he's set standards with others that if you don't play well you will be dropped so he can only offer him so much slack before he has to make the tough call and put in either Elanga or Garnacho.

It's such a shame because up until the break for the queen he was starting to look like he was finding his form but since then he's looked poor.
 
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Next 6 months are huge for him.

ETH can’t be happy with what he’s seen from him so far and with Garnacho emerging his spot in the squad is under serious threat.

He needs to use this break to get himself fully fit and ready to explode when the games restart.

If he doesn’t show up in what’s left of the season I can see ETH looking to move him on.
 
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I saw that earlier and still aren't sure what to make of it. Dutch coaches. Keep fit. Refocus. Does that imply that fitness and focus are his issues? Are these coaches working on the mental and physical preparation aspect of his game? Obviously the break from social media would suggest there's something mental/emotional/social going on which he could use some help with.

There's a player in there and hopefully whatever is happening can help him get back to his best.
 
If I had to guess I'd say he's struggling with the adaptation to a club the size of Utd and the setback that he's had. Up until this point in his career he's always been the best player and found things easy since he's come to Utd that hasn't been the case.

I'd say that comes down to two things.

Physically ever since he came I don't think he's looked fit he looks like he has another gear that he can go into when dribbling at speed but he just doesn't use it. It just felt to me like last season he never really got going at all it was all very stop start and it just didn't look to me like he was fit at all. Even now he's often the one being subbed off after 60 minutes as he looks knackered he needs to sort that out and become a guy that can go full throttle for 90 minutes. Dalot used to have the same issues but he seems to be over that now.

Mentally I think the Euros knocked his confidence he didn't really perform to his best in the tournament and missing in the shoot out probably hung over him to. At the start of the season he actually looked like he'd shaken that off but when we had that 2-3 week break for the queens funeral he lost that momentum and never really got going again.

Coming off social media is probably a good thing, going away for a mid season training camp is also a smart move and if he's working with coaches who can help him grasp the ETH style that will help even more.
 
I think Ronaldo has been having a negative effect on some players too, and probably the group. So lets hope he now kicks on and whatever he's doing helps that
 
The Ronaldo stuff for me has been an easy excuse for people to point the finger of blame at him.

Fact is Sancho even when Ronaldo hasn't played has not looked like the player he was at Dortmund.

Last season was a mess on the pitch for a whole host of reasons so for me those that stayed started this season with a clean slate under the new boss. Most of the lads have re-discovered their form under ETH for Sancho it's not quite happened yet. We got some brief glimpses that things were starting to come together for him but it's sadly dropped off again for him.

There's big pressure on him now with Garnacho starting to break through and Anthony coming in the summer there's real competition in wide areas when everyone is fit. Sancho needs to take that challenge head on and make sure he's a go to guy under ETH.
 
One foot out the door for me, he's just not cut-out for United, and I wouldn't be surprised if we sell him back to Dortmund for £40m, or offer him in part-exchange for Moukoko in the Summer.
 
Not sure if Sancho would take that offer of going back to Germany as he'd have to take a massive pay cut.

If he went back Bayern might be tempted if they think they can get him firing again.

I tend to agree though if he doesn't show up in the second half of the season he'll be up for sale along with a load of others players this summer.
 
I never saw him at Dortmund only what was written about him....I had it in my mind that he was fast but I haven't seen that at United he seems unable to beat ppl for pace....have I got this wrong....is he actually quick but struggling for confidence and fitness or is he just not that pacey really?
 
ROBSON No7 said:
I never saw him at Dortmund only what was written about him....I had it in my mind that he was fast but I haven't seen that at United he seems unable to beat ppl for pace....have I got this wrong....is he actually quick but struggling for confidence and fitness or is he just not that pacey really?
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He was never lightning fast but his close control and skill made him very good one vs one bit like Hazard and Grealish is how I'd describe him one vs one. He's the opposite to Rashford in that out wide he wants the ball to feet rather than looking to run in behind the opponent and attack the space.

His decision making in the final third was always excellent his passing and crossing was brilliant, knew exactly when to release the ball and always put the perfect weight on the pass/cross for the striker. He never really got an understanding going with Ronaldo maybe things will improve with his replacement as he's got the ability to find any striker who has good movement in the box.

The dips in form happened at Dortmund too it wasn't all plain sailing with him in his final season with them the first half of the season he was pretty poor the second half of the season he was on fire.

Think the big difference I see is the defending in the Bundesliga is awful there's very few teams who defend well it's why Bayern stick 5 past everyone home and away most weeks. It's a step up in quality he's just not adapted to and handled similar to how Memphis struggled when he arrived, confidence dipped and he's lost a bit of his belief that he can beat his man.

I think getting himself fitter might find a bit more acceleration which will help his game but a big worry is to me he looks a bit soft dangles his leg into tackles rather than going in full force.
 
jsp said:
He was never lightning fast but his close control and skill made him very good one vs one bit like Hazard and Grealish is how I'd describe him one vs one. He's the opposite to Rashford in that out wide he wants the ball to feet rather than looking to run in behind the opponent and attack the space.

His decision making in the final third was always excellent his passing and crossing was brilliant, knew exactly when to release the ball and always put the perfect weight on the pass/cross for the striker. He never really got an understanding going with Ronaldo maybe things will improve with his replacement as he's got the ability to find any striker who has good movement in the box.

The dips in form happened at Dortmund too it wasn't all plain sailing with him in his final season with them the first half of the season he was pretty poor the second half of the season he was on fire.

Think the big difference I see is the defending in the Bundesliga is awful there's very few teams who defend well it's why Bayern stick 5 past everyone home and away most weeks. It's a step up in quality he's just not adapted to and handled similar to how Memphis struggled when he arrived, confidence dipped and he's lost a bit of his belief that he can beat his man.

I think getting himself fitter might find a bit more acceleration which will help his game but a big worry is to me he looks a bit soft dangles his leg into tackles rather than going in full force.
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Not sure about that, Memphis started like a house on fire, scoring goals and creating chances, but when Shaw got injured his form plummeted and he never really recovered.
 
jsp said:
He was never lightning fast but his close control and skill made him very good one vs one bit like Hazard and Grealish is how I'd describe him one vs one. He's the opposite to Rashford in that out wide he wants the ball to feet rather than looking to run in behind the opponent and attack the space.

His decision making in the final third was always excellent his passing and crossing was brilliant, knew exactly when to release the ball and always put the perfect weight on the pass/cross for the striker. He never really got an understanding going with Ronaldo maybe things will improve with his replacement as he's got the ability to find any striker who has good movement in the box.

The dips in form happened at Dortmund too it wasn't all plain sailing with him in his final season with them the first half of the season he was pretty poor the second half of the season he was on fire.

Think the big difference I see is the defending in the Bundesliga is awful there's very few teams who defend well it's why Bayern stick 5 past everyone home and away most weeks. It's a step up in quality he's just not adapted to and handled similar to how Memphis struggled when he arrived, confidence dipped and he's lost a bit of his belief that he can beat his man.

I think getting himself fitter might find a bit more acceleration which will help his game but a big worry is to me he looks a bit soft dangles his leg into tackles rather than going in full force.
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Good scout report....
 
Justin Cider said:
Not sure about that, Memphis started like a house on fire, scoring goals and creating chances, but when Shaw got injured his form plummeted and he never really recovered.
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The good bit of Memphis lasted about a month from memory he played well in the champions league qualifier home and away vs Brugge but that was about it.

It was more the comparison about how he struggled to adapt to a higher standard of defending. I always felt with him he'd been used to life in Holland where he was quicker and stronger than all the defenders and used that to his advantage. In the Premier League he found those weapons were gone and he didn't really know how to change his game to adapt to the fact that those physical advantages were gone.
 
jsp said:
The good bit of Memphis lasted about a month from memory he played well in the champions league qualifier home and away vs Brugge but that was about it.

It was more the comparison about how he struggled to adapt to a higher standard of defending. I always felt with him he'd been used to life in Holland where he was quicker and stronger than all the defenders and used that to his advantage. In the Premier League he found those weapons were gone and he didn't really know how to change his game to adapt to the fact that those physical advantages were gone.
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You struggle to adapt in the first few weeks, not after proving you can cope early on, it was once his boyfriend Shaw got injured he faded, badly, then when the more unsavoury element among our online fans targeted him he wilted, and it was best for all concerned he moved on.
 
Justin Cider said:
You struggle to adapt in the first few weeks, not after proving you can cope early on, it was once his boyfriend Shaw got injured he faded, badly, then when the more unsavoury element among our online fans targeted him he wilted, and it was best for all concerned he moved on.
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He had two good games against a pretty average Brugge team, can vaguely remember 1 league game away at Watford where he played well. He was found out in the premier league simple as that. He wasn't ready for the challenge on the pitch and the mental challenge that comes off it at Utd. It wasn't just online fans who thought he was cr*p it was fans at the games as well they got behind him as best they can same with Sancho but they're starting to get frustrated with him as well.

Fans will forgive a player who's trying and failing they won't stand for a guy who just chucks in the towel which sadly is what ended up happening with Memphis. If you want to be a flash character with your fur coats and rolls royce you need to deliver on the pitch otherwise your average fan is going to think your a bit of a knob.

He made a smart move to Lyon and rebuilt his career as a number 9 and got himself a good move to Barcelona where sadly he's ended up being part of that absolute financial mess.

Utd need a short term fix at number 9 in January he might be someone they consider in desperation.

Another good example is Dembele at Barcelona an incredible talent but it took him a few years at Barcelona to start showing what he can do on a consistent basis.

Sancho has been at the club for 18 months and he's on his third manager all with different ideas on how the game is played. He needs to show he can get on board the ETH way if he can't he'll want him out.
 
Sancho had a serious dip in form after his first move to United fell through, only to pick it up in the second half of the season. Maybe that's neither here nor there, but it does suggest a pattern of emotion impacting form. I've always seen him as a player that is at his best when he's playing off of his attacking teammates, which has been challenging at United when Martial is perma-crocked, Ronaldo wasn't capable or willing and Rashford has been struggling for his own form.

Hopefully this break can get him sorted out and he can take off after the World Cup.
 
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No, very unusual situation.

We've got some real problems in this squad.
 
SuperRash said:
A player has a couple of problems and you’d move him on straight away?

Hope he can get his head straight and whatever else he needs to do because there is a player in there for sure.
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United's history is littered with extremely talented 'ballers' that just couldn't hack playing at Old Trafford, no shame in that ....

If his fitness had dropped to such a level in a World cup year to such an extent EtH didn't think it was worth taking him to Spain for the recent jolly-up that is disturbing on it's own, more worryingly if it's a confidence issue he ain't getting that back anytime soon, and this is a kid that was so sure of his ability he left one of the best run academies in the country(Watford), to join City who, like Chelsea before them, were hoovering up all the best young talent in the Country. Then at City he was so cock-sure he was the next big-thing he left City at the earliest opportunity, granted he did very very well in Germany, but the Premier League is on a different level all together and Sancho is finding that out the hard way.

Like Pogba when he forced his way out of United the first-time, Sancho is finding out that the coaches at City(rated the best in the Country)probably knew what was best for his development and to bide his time, as did Sir Alex and his staff for Pogba, though Pogba was as much driven by the emergence of the super Agents as they like to call themselves, as Pogba thinking he should be in the first-team when it was obvious to anybody that watched him he was nowhere near ready.

Obviously hope i'm 100% wrong and he comes back and smashes it at Old Trafford, just can't see it, sometimes it's just best to move on, that's before you factor in Garnacho, if he sees the club pamper to Sancho he might well feel he's better off moving elsewhere, and off the two Garnacho has by far the higher-ceiling, in my opinion.
 
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Credit to Sancho being proactive in trying to work on his physical AND mental health, to then make his way back to form and fitness.
 
I want to know if he has a fragile mentality in general, or if something has triggered it and it's short term.

Of course he needs to resolve it for himself. But as club, don't think we can afford to carry anyone long term at the moment. And if it is a long term thing, maybe he should look at getting out of football for his mental health. I imagine it's a tough environment, especially at united.
 
Last year was pretty tough for him as a young man.

He obviously had the set back of missing the penalty in the shoot out in the euros and all the grief that came his way from that, his big money move to Utd didn't pan out the way he hoped on the field and he lost a close family member last season as well. His Auntie died in January. So he's kind of been dealing with a lot of stuff both on and off the pitch.

I think it's a good move that he's shown willing to work with the manager and take steps to help himself by coming off social media completely and also going off and doing some one to one training with someone the manager thinks can help him. He's not the first person to have these problems in their career the first step to sorting out that problem is to admit that you have that problem and try to make a change.

Football takes a brutal tole on your mental well being with huge highs and lows and only those who can manage that sort of swing survive in the game. You can't allow the lows to drag you down and you also can't just live in the highs.

A big thing that will help his game is getting himself physically fitter as that has been a problem for him at Utd he only lasts 60 minutes if he can address that and get himself into better physical shape it may then help his confidence.
 

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