Fred | Match Discussion thread 2020/21

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Cosmic Slop

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Scrapped away in midfield as he does he’s a tenacious little devil technically he’s not one of the best we’ve seen in that midfield but he scraps and never gives up you need that in a team.
There was an inherent flaw in the way Ole set us up today (vs. Southampton). Both full backs were poor, but when it's both of them it's because something is not going right ahead of them in midfield. Using a quasi double pivot with Matic and Fred meant that neither was available to effectively protect the fullback. It was very apparent on AWB's side, Dnejpro kept running past him with relative ease. I think the Matic + Fred pairing is not as good as one with McTominay in there. Matic did not have a great game and his reaction speeds are way down. Half time Ole should have subbed out one of those two and brought in McTominay. So it's hard to say if the midfield chaos was despite or because of Fred. Today he was too often seen chasing after someone who'd gone past him, including when he stupidly kicked the opponent's legs leading to the foul from which Ward-Prowse scored his free kick and DeGea got injured. Fred had some good moments and some bad ones today, mediocre performance.
 

jsp

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There was an inherent flaw in the way Ole set us up today (vs. Southampton). Both full backs were poor, but when it's both of them it's because something is not going right ahead of them in midfield. Using a quasi double pivot with Matic and Fred meant that neither was available to effectively protect the fullback. It was very apparent on AWB's side, Dnejpro kept running past him with relative ease. I think the Matic + Fred pairing is not as good as one with McTominay in there. Matic did not have a great game and his reaction speeds are way down. Half time Ole should have subbed out one of those two and brought in McTominay. So it's hard to say if the midfield chaos was despite or because of Fred. Today he was too often seen chasing after someone who'd gone past him, including when he stupidly kicked the opponent's legs leading to the foul from which Ward-Prowse scored his free kick and DeGea got injured. Fred had some good moments and some bad ones today, mediocre performance.

Think Matic was there today purely for muscle that Romeu likes putting it about in midfield and Adams is a physical striker to I think he wanted Matic to be a bit of an enforcer and a calm head. He knew they didn’t really have the running power in the middle to run past him.

I do think his best days are long past him but they never really got through the middle of the pitch and their wide players are tricky but not really effective.

We all know if we want to win a title then it’s unlikely these 2 will be regulars I do wonder if giving Matic a new deal was a bit of a silly panic but that’s sort of how we roll as a club

Bit of a make or break season for Fred that’ll be 3 years into a 5 year contract so Utd have a decision to make on him.
 

Shoot

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Think Matic was there today purely for muscle that Romeu likes putting it about in midfield and Adams is a physical striker to I think he wanted Matic to be a bit of an enforcer and a calm head. He knew they didn’t really have the running power in the middle to run past him.

I do think his best days are long past him but they never really got through the middle of the pitch and their wide players are tricky but not really effective.

We all know if we want to win a title then it’s unlikely these 2 will be regulars I do wonder if giving Matic a new deal was a bit of a silly panic but that’s sort of how we roll as a club

Bit of a make or break season for Fred that’ll be 3 years into a 5 year contract so Utd have a decision to make on him.
It takes a squad to go the course of a season and win titles / trophies (especially this season). I am glad we have Matic in the squad.
 

Cosmic Slop

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Today vs PSG Fred was a lucky boy to not get a red for making a head butting motion at / towards Paredes. I don’t know how that was ruled a yellow, but Paredes also deserved a yellow for simulation. Later in the first half Fred fouled Paredes again, studs on top of his foot, and again that should have been yellow - but Paredes got it instead.

Fred is walking a tightrope here. I’m worried he’s getting that second yellow and will be off. Ole should hook him at halftime.

Fred did have another beautiful pass over the top for Bruno. I’d love to see more of this side of his game.
 

jsp

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Sadly it looked like we were getting VDB ready as the incident happened so it may be had he got away with that final tackle which wasn't a foul then he may have been the man to be hooked.

Think the issue is Ole feels he needs that aggression Fred brings in this system his alternatives in Pogba/Matic/VDB are totally different players that's why I think he was reluctant to take Fred off but eventually his luck run out.

The second yellow is a result of a bigger problem with Fred and that is his close control isn't of the highest level he's got a loose touch so he often has to lunge to get the ball back under control. There's plenty to like about Fred but he's nowhere near the level of the top midfielders.
 

SuperRash

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I thought he was actually pretty disciplined in the second half and the foul for his second yellow was absolutely nothing. In hindsight should have been hooked.

I guess when you are walking a tightrope the worst team to be playing against is PSG, they are a bunch of dirty scum bags who would go down like a sack of spuds if it meant getting someone sent off.
 

jsp

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Oh yeah 100% PSG are a massive bunch of cry babies always in the refs ear asking for cards but Utd did rough them up a bit last night and the ref did allow it so can see why they were getting wound up.

That's the thing after half time Fred was fine he clearly felt he'd calmed the situation down but on a yellow he couldn't afford to take any risks but he had no choice his touch was so bad he had to make sure he didn't let Herrera nick the ball and he got there but you can 100% see why the ref thought he was late.

Herrera is a dirty git and made sure it looked like a foul by Fred to get him sent off but the ref didn't need much convincing.
 

Shoot

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Fred actually played very well. His head push was completely foolish though and we couldn't have complained if we were down to 10 men in the first half.
Wonder how we would have fared in the game then.
 

jsp

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Fred actually played very well. His head push was completely foolish though and we couldn't have complained if we were down to 10 men in the first half.
Wonder how we would have fared in the game then.

Think at 0-1 we'd have been stuffed we'd of had to drop in and hold on then try to go for it at the end but with their quality they'd have opened us up a few times.

Fred's been in decent form lately he works well with McTominay I think Ole clearly has that as his number 1 pair even though it's not always popular with fans because they are a bit vanilla as a pair but it works. They're the paid I'd be picking in nearly every game.

Think this will be Fred's 3rd season at the club at the end of this year to me he's nothing more than a squad player but we've got way to many of these "squad" player types knocking around as I'd have McTominay in the same category.
 

Cosmic Slop

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Think at 0-1 we'd have been stuffed we'd of had to drop in and hold on then try to go for it at the end but with their quality they'd have opened us up a few times.

Fred's been in decent form lately he works well with McTominay I think Ole clearly has that as his number 1 pair even though it's not always popular with fans because they are a bit vanilla as a pair but it works. They're the paid I'd be picking in nearly every game.

Think this will be Fred's 3rd season at the club at the end of this year to me he's nothing more than a squad player but we've got way to many of these "squad" player types knocking around as I'd have McTominay in the same category.
It will be interesting to see if Fred is given a new contract. We massively overpaid for him, and he's been (as you said) a squad player at best. It will show Ole's intent if he doesn't sell Fred or allow him to leave. Just like it was clear to all sentient beings that Fred was about to et sent off against PSG, it's clear that Fred isn't what this team needs going forwards.

Wait, who am I kidding? The only question is whether Fred will get a 2 year or a 3 year new deal.
 

jsp

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It will be interesting to see if Fred is given a new contract. We massively overpaid for him, and he's been (as you said) a squad player at best. It will show Ole's intent if he doesn't sell Fred or allow him to leave. Just like it was clear to all sentient beings that Fred was about to et sent off against PSG, it's clear that Fred isn't what this team needs going forwards.

Wait, who am I kidding? The only question is whether Fred will get a 2 year or a 3 year new deal.

I’d get Matic and Pogba out this summer try and get a top quality holding midfield player.

Maybe extend Fred now give him a 2 year top up on the same salary keep him as a squad player try and move him out at the end of next season.

Like Matic we probably let Fred contract run down to 6 months then pay him a stupid salary on a 4 year deal because they’re desperate not to lose him on a free.

Fred is another signing we will be taking a big financial hit on at some point I mean how did we pay 50m for him?
 

Shoot

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It will be interesting to see if Fred is given a new contract. We massively overpaid for him, and he's been (as you said) a squad player at best. It will show Ole's intent if he doesn't sell Fred or allow him to leave. Just like it was clear to all sentient beings that Fred was about to et sent off against PSG, it's clear that Fred isn't what this team needs going forwards.

Wait, who am I kidding? The only question is whether Fred will get a 2 year or a 3 year new deal.
Your Fred obsession is of course well known, I dont totally disagree with you but there are others give me concern that are higher on my priority list. At least Fred puts a shift in and has been very useful in his combative role (most of the time). We all know his shortcomings but this team can only evolve at a certain pace in the circumstances. I don't think we will be looking to off load Fred anytime soon. But yes, we need an upgrade in the course of time.
 

jsp

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Funny thing listening to podcasts since the game one with two foreign journalists basically saying that in Europe what Fred did isn't considered a red card offence it only seems to be in England we have this level of enforcement.

This sort of pushing with your head when two players square up normally results in a yellow card.
 

Shoot

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Funny thing listening to podcasts since the game one with two foreign journalists basically saying that in Europe what Fred did isn't considered a red card offence it only seems to be in England we have this level of enforcement.

This sort of pushing with your head when two players square up normally results in a yellow card.
Yea but somebody shot Paredes in the chest at the same time, did you not notice the force of the blast!
 

jsp

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Yea but somebody shot Paredes in the chest at the same time, did you not notice the force of the blast!

That was basically what they were saying Paredes instigated the whole thing then went down like he'd been shot.

Surely with VAR the ref should see stuff like that and go both players get a yellow you for minor contact and you for being a div.

It was just like the Martial one earlier in the season he was silly to do what he did but really a red card for violent conduct?

No one talking about Neymar grabbing McTominay by the nuts before he stood on his ankle?

It was non stop from these lot and we kept falling for it.
 

jsp

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Premier League Fulham 1-2 Man Utd

Thought he was poor tonight his passing really is a problem in games we are dominating it needs to be sharper.
 

jsp

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Palace 0-0 Man Utd

Sell him in the summer cannot be relied on just nowhere near the quality of a Utd centre mid there are no excuses.

Runs around and looks busy but his passing is league one standard he’s one footed and constantly gives the ball away simple passes under no pressure on his strong foot. He kills us going forward time after time.
 

jsp

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Whatever happens in the summer we can’t be starting next season with him as a starter serious midfield reinforcements required.

He really needs moving on next season he should be nothing more than a bench option.
 

jsp

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We do not have one central midfield player that gets into another top 6 team.

POGBA starts for every team in this league even when he’s being frustrating.

I’d argue McTominay starts in a few as well but yeah we don’t have much quality in this area and it needs addressing.
 

boothstownred

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POGBA starts for every team in this league even when he’s being frustrating.

I’d argue McTominay starts in a few as well but yeah we don’t have much quality in this area and it needs addressing.
I have constantly argued that Pogba should be starting as one of the two in midfield, but apparently he is not good enough defensively for that. I am not sure whether I completely forgot about Pogba or whether I did not consider him a central midfield player.
 

jsp

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I have constantly argued that Pogba should be starting as one of the two in midfield, but apparently he is not good enough defensively for that. I am not sure whether I completely forgot about Pogba or whether I did not consider him a central midfield player.

Think it made sense to start him wide today we were short of options just back from injury maybe knew he only had an hour in the tank and he provided the moment of quality.

I think McTominay is a player a lot of managers would love to have but he wouldn’t start for Leicester their 2 would start for us every week I think they are a big part of why that team is so good right now. Utd and many others really missed a trick with Tielemans not taking him away from Leicester after his initial loan move he’s a cracking player.
 

boothstownred

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I would not be getting rid of McT, far from it but I cannot think of too many top team who he would start regularly for.
 

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Fred isn't good enough often enough. Too often he's plain shite. Frustrating thing is he has the odd game where he shows the potential that someone must have spotted in order to sign him in the first place.

McT has the skills and the engine to be a powerhouse. He needs to make sure he brings his 'A' game to every game. He's looks a better player than a 24 y.o. Jordan Henderson.

Fred's and McT's wavering form are not isolated though; we struggle for consistency all over the pitch.
 

IDFD

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POGBA starts for every team in this league even when he’s being frustrating.

I’d argue McTominay starts in a few as well but yeah we don’t have much quality in this area and it needs addressing.

Not sure I can agree that McTominay gets in another top 6 side. Certainly isn't getting in the City, Liverpool, Chelsea or Leicester side though.
 

jsp

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Not sure I can agree that McTominay gets in another top 6 side. Certainly isn't getting in the City, Liverpool, Chelsea or Leicester side though.

Like I said he's borderline City obviously not but I think he'd get plenty of games at Liverpool/Chelsea/West Ham/Spurs.
 

jsp

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Man Utd 2-1 Brighton

His best game in a long time passing was much better and also seemed much better at winning the ball back 2 weeks off might have done him some good
 

Shot

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Is it Fred or is it Thread? or is it a Fred about Thread or a Thread about Fred? I can't start a Fred or a Thread :rolleyes: maybe its a Fred about a Kipper
Done up like a kipper.
 
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