Victor Lindelof | Match Discussion thread 2020/21

RichH2016

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I thought overall Lindelof played well. I missed the Everton goal but watched just after they had scored and he handled them well. Mind you it did help that their crossing was poor and they only had 1 striker.
 

jsp

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Just seen the goal, de gea should have saved it, other defender I assume AWB should have shown him the other way, another goal because of lots of errors.

I never see you in here calling all Maguire's errors, of which there are many.

You just have an agenda against him

You’re blaming De Gea for that? Watch it again honestly mate he’s got nil chance it’s through the legs.

Lindelof is weak on the header, AWB doesn’t get close to block the shot and should not be letting him come inside De Gea has no chance.

I know Lindelof is your guy but there’s plenty of criticism of Maguire for his recent cock ups and there’s been plenty but you can’t just deflect like that it kills your argument. Today Maguire was an absolute rock whereas Lindelof was identified by our opponent as a weak link and it cost us a goal.

Against a certain type of striker he has a real problem because he doesn’t dominate a direct ball in the air. He grafted and gave it his all but it’s a weakness he can’t do much about and teams will exploit it.
 

Mr C

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Got no problem criticising players at all, Lindelof should have done better so should have AWB and DeGea

Motd just started, Maguire, first highlight , Maguire got done by cl, just over the bar. No mention of this, could easily have been a goal

It's the complete bias on here that does my head in. None of our CB have been good enough, to single out one is out of order.

They are not helped by a weak midfield though
 

IDFD

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Premier League: Manchester United 0-0 Chelsea - 24th October 2020

Credit where it's due. He was fantastic today.

@Mr C

Just want to show that I said this after the Chelsea game. My agenda with Lindelof is that he's poor in the air and gets bullied. But when he puts in a good performance i'll make it known. I'm not blinkered I just often see him as our weak link. (Like he was today)

An agenda is when you can't criticize a player you like for a poor performance or praise one you don't for an excellent performance. I'm not the one with the agenda.
 

IDFD

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Its the complete bias on here that does my head in. None of our CB have been good enough, to single out one is out of order.

If Lindelof had put in the performance Maguire did today i'd have been straight on here praising him for his performance and how solid he was at the back.

However he wasn't he was the player DCL looked to bully and managed to. The weak link whilst Maguire was excellent.

You can call it okay if you want. But if we got that sort of performance from Lindelof every other weekend i'd be absolutely ecstatic.
 

Mr C

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I'm not even sure he can win that header without causing a foul
 

jsp

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West Ham 1-3 Man Utd

Think he’s found some good form lately

He was good again today his passing out from the back is good and he’s not being bullied by attackers like he was earlier this season.
 

jsp

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Premier League: Leicester City 2-2 Manchester United - 26th December 2020

Went off injured and Ole’s post game comments maybe suggest that the back issue he’s been playing with is now at the point where they have to take action.

Think people know where I stand on him but he’s been in decent form recently.
 

Sideshow Bob

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Premier League: Liverpool 0-0 Manchester United - 17th January 2021

He didn’t let his manager down. Played well.
 

SuperRash

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Yeah played very well today, I didn’t think the partnership of Bailly/Maguire should have been split up but credit where it’s due.
 

jsp

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West Brom 1-1 Man Utd

May have been fouled but was far to weak on the goal never looked favourite for that ball and was not in control of the situation at all.

I’m just sick of him we may have a lot of issues but buying a better CB than him would be number 1 on my list.
 

IDFD

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Is the foul on him that Maguire was complaining about in the post match? I was trying to work out what foul he kept on banging on about for their goal. That's reaching.

Today Lindelof gave us the full repertoire. Poor challenges in the air, woefully out of position then completely losing his head. It was bad even by his standards.

How anyone could watch today's game and then say with a straight face they think Lindelof is a better defender than Maguire I have no idea. He wouldn't make any team in the league on that performance.

Some are trying to bail him out by blaming De Gea but regardless he cannot be losing the header with the respective positions of the two players when the ball comes in.

He shouldn't be playing in the premier League. He's not strong enough in the air to make it work.
 

jsp

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Yeah Maguire decided as captain to call out the referee decisions we’ve had in recent weeks he felt Lindelof was fouled and that he was fouled for the penalty that was over turned by VAR.
 

IDFD

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Just seen some stills of the goal now I'm a bit more calm and not directly after the goal. Even though he should be attacking that ball in a similar manner the striker is and not just standing there hoping it comes to is possibly s foul and Maguire did have a point in the post match interview.
 

Mr C

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Yeah IDFD, you do go ott in Lindelof, the attacker had his hand over lindelofs eyes. It was a foul, De Gea came the stopped.

Saying that, those 3 need improving on big time

Maguire pen shout, he was offside.
 

IDFD

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He's still as fault and it's awful defending.

The same way I slammed Maguire for d!cking about. Just clear the damn ball and worry about a foul later.

De Gea isn't to blame at all. Lindelof just has to put his big boy pants on and actually defend. If he attacks that ball in a similar way to the striker it's still 0-0 and nothing else matters.
 

Mr C

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I thought it was going to be worse. It's a foul for me. But yeah, Maguire and him should be doing much better

It's not De Gea's fault, but it is another sign of his indecision. Ole said the wind held it up which could be an excuse for coming then going back.

We need to improve to get that top 4
 

jsp

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Oh yeah conditions were very tough strong winds and the curve on the ball makes it one that De Gea can't come for but despite the foul I do think Lindelof has to be more in control of the situation by attacking the ball he just seems to get himself stuck on the ground he isn't attacking the ball which gives the striker a chance to nip in.

It is a foul and then I haven't seen the replay for sure but Lindelof should be going ballistic at the ref over it this team needs to start getting into these refs what is going on with these decisions. You give them a video replay and they still can't spot the guys climbed all over our player not far off a headlock.

Neville was very critical of both centre backs on the goal for their position on the cross they are so deep in the box allowing their strikers into the penalty area by dropping deep and not pushing up.
 

Mr C

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VAR are meant to review every goal, how they deem an attacker can cover up the defenders eyes is beyond me.

But it wasn't Lindelofs only error. And the Maguire one was really bad too. We shouldn't be doing those errors.
 

jsp

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I think the standard of refereeing this season has been awful both on the pitch and with VAR the decisions are just getting worse.

How you can watch that and allow it to stand is crazy but again I don't think the Utd players react with any real fury to make the ref think there's a mistake just like the De Gea one. Can you imagine a Fergie side standing for this they'd have chased the ref down until he went to the booth to check. Ole needs to be getting into that 4th official on the side line not rolling his eyes when he sees the replay.

It is to nice.
 

IDFD

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Gary Neville analysing the centre backs on Sky Sports now.

Saying it was never a foul.

Lindelof reminds him of himself playing at CB. Not strong enough and can't handle it physically.

Maguire and Lindelof as a partnership are conceding a goal a game. 18 clean sheets in 51 games. Only 1 CB partnership has conceded a goal a game and won a league title.

Lindelof has to go and we need to find a quick partner for Maguire in the Bailly model to allow us to defend 10 yards further up the pitch.

Lindelofs biggest problem is Maguire and Maguires biggest problem is Lindelof. Both are top players but not alongside each other in Nevilles opinion and make each other look poorer. (Sure we can all see an element to that and that's why they're divisive.)

Carragher says the goalkeeper is more important to sort out before the CB partnership and he'd have Henderson in goal for the remainder of the season so we know if we need to buy a keeper this summer.
 

Mr C

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I agree to a degree the keeper needs sorting first, a better keeper could organise them and maybe give them a bit more confidence to play further up.

But the spine of the team needs a revamp.

It's a foul, I don't care what Neville says, but lindelof did worse during that game. Show the rest of the tosh, not where he was fouled.

I don't think Ole has the balls to drop De Gea so that problem is going to roll onto next season.

I still say, top 4 this season will be great, it will feel bad because of where we were, but that's more to do with other teams slumping. I would have taken it pre season.

The worry is, the longer the season goes on, the more our players are exposed and just don't don't look good enough. Start of the season I'd have said we need 3, now it's more like 6 new players
 

jsp

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To me that team needs key players right through the centre next season we need to start with a new GK, CB, CM and CF those 4 positions all need to be strengthened.

Henderson may solve the GK spot personally I'd with Carra put him in now and give him a run of games to see if he's the answer.

At CB this partnership needs to be broken a defender with similar attributes to Bailly is required but one that isn't make of glass given that Ole signed Maguire and made him captain it's unlikely he'd be the one to be benched but Lindelof would be a great deputy to Maguire to keep him on his toes.

I'm sort of with Neville in that he allows himself to be fouled by not being dominating in that situation he never looks to attack the ball so it doesn't look like a foul but regardless of that the striker climbs all over him which is a foul.

A quality central midfield player is required to push Fred down the pecking order as is a top class centre forward that isn't 34 years old so can handle 50 games a season and lead the team. Lets be honest Lukaku hasn't really been replaced not that selling him was a mistake but Cavani was papering over the crack a short term solution to a longer term problem.
 

Cosmic Slop

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So is it always going to be the squad's fault? Seems like we've needed between 4 and 8 players for ever.
It's the squad's fault for not being good enough but also the fault of whoever thought it was a good idea to sign them.

We needed 4 or 5 players since Fergie retired. Fergie was able to get the best out of his players and we haven't had a manager since him who has been able to work the same magic. Maybe few managers can do it. Arguably Klopp and Guardiola can, although they've also been indulged and backed with a lot of transfers.

I'm starting to think the problem isn't Lindelof + Maguire so much as Lindelof + DeGea. On the Diagne goal where (in my opinion) he was totally fouled, there did not appear to be communication between him and DeGea. Lindelof initially tries to block off Diagne, maybe thinking DeGea would come off his line and claim it. But what we've seen repeatedly is that DeGea is reluctant to do that. I think it's understandable to think your keeper could get to a cross easier than a defender.

Either way, our CB pairing is not producing the required results. Put DeGea in that mix and they aren't complementing each other's strengths, only magnifying each other's weaknesses.

DeGea is the only one of the three that had any realistic claim to being one of the best in the world, or even top quality. If we have to choose between those three, it's get rid of both CBs and keep DeGea for me. Yes, DeGea has been in a dip of form but he's kept our side in the mix.
 

IDFD

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So is it always going to be the squad's fault? Seems like we've needed between 4 and 8 players for ever.

I think ultimately it's a combination of both.

Ole has to take the blame for continuing to play the pair together.

But ultimately in midfield we aren't strong enough and Fred has to play certain games. On the right wing our options are Greenwood it no one and upfront it's either a 34 yr old man or Martial whose couldn't show less interest if he tried.
 

jsp

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I think to win the league back everyone needs to be better from top to bottom City really are rolling and Liverpool showed to take the title from them now it requires near perfection.

The team involved in recruitment will need to find clever ways of getting the best available talent across the world for the manager. I think they've upped their game massively in the last 2 seasons but it's a tough market but they may have made a very bold moving securing all this young talent rather than going big for an established star like Sancho at the peak of his value, time will tell! Can they land a potential game changer like Haaland over City like we did nearly 10 years ago with RVP?

The manager needs to show that he belongs in the same conversation as the top managers in Europe. As good a job as he has done so far if Utd sacked him tomorrow is he getting another big job? I still think there's concerns over style of play under Ole we really struggle against a packed defence and we don't seem to have an organised way of breaking these teams down it's really a reliance on individual moments of brilliance. I still don't see a front 3 who link together well and play off each other to make each other better like the very best do. Trophies and results will elevate his status as currently he isn't in the conversation of world best manager.

The players need to be better reality is to an extent you are only as good as your players. I still look at our starting XI and see a lot of weak points GK, CB, CM, RW, CF to me the players currently occupying those starting positions are not title winners.

Guardiola couldn't win a title until he had the players he wanted in his squad and the same goes for Klopp. Klopp was struggling to get top 4 when he had a keeper chucking in howlers on a regular basis and dodgy centre backs once he sorted those problems they were flying.
 

Mr C

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I don't think you can be shooting at Ole, to get this team second is an amazing achievement.

The problem you highlight re: tight teams is one of the area's we need to recruit. I have said before, we need to give VDB a chance. Like Henderson, we need to try these players over a series of games. If they are not good enough we need to move them on. We can't have a squad of has beens and untried players.

There is still big movements to be done in the window, and to 0-Dog, the reason is the poor last window. We are ow two windows behind.

I've been reading about Mbappe's perfrmance last night, front page of L'equipe has Pique desperately pulling at his shirt. I understand Pique was removed shortly after. Lets get him hahaha
 

jsp

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I think you can fairly shoot at Ole without calling for his head he isn't without criticism in all of this he's picked De Gea all season, he's stuck with the Lindelof/Maguire partnership for a second season despite the warning signs last season and he's delivered some really bad results this season. Let's not forget despite winning the first 2 games in the CL group we went out losing 3 of our last 4 group games and 2 of the performances were pathetic. Week after week we start badly he clearly isn't getting the team prepared properly and on their toes to start matches it's like we treat the first 15 minutes as a bloody warm up.

That isn't to suggest he should be sacked far from it he is on track to meet his top 4 target but progress will be judged by where we finish not where we are now. Lets hope he can get a strong finish out of these lads now like last seasons and get us second place and a cup in the final push. This slump carries on much longer and we'll be out of the top 4 if our rivals were actually in any sort of form they'd have already caught us the last 6 weeks have been really poor.

Based on points per game so far we are currently on track for 73 points which would be 7 points better than last seasons total good progress but still nowhere near good enough for a title.

Getting Mbappe would be unreal but it's sad that Utd aren't even in the conversation for a player like him it shows how far we've fallen that lad is just crazy good. Think Pique was playing his first game in 4 months after a knee injury so I would imagine the last thing he wanted at his age after that was Mbappe running at him. That Barca side are finished they look like they're going to be in the wilderness for years to come.
 

Mr C

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Lets not forget he received none of the players he wanted in the last window. As far as I am concerned that last window is a free pass, I'm amazed we are where we are.

He doesn't sell the players either, Woodward does, why do we still have so many players in our squad who are not going to play. We can't buy CB's when have 5 or 6 already (start of season)

He hasn't exactly got much choice at CB has he. Although I assume he did want Maguire, which does look a mistake.

As for the keeper, this is an odd for me, he must see something in training.
 

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