Massimiliano Allegri targets United job

jsp

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I'd take him if we had a better squad but he's not the type of guy who builds something he's the sort of guy who comes in and gets the best out of the high quality players.

I think the article is misleading I reckon he's more likely to end up at Arsenal than Utd as I think they'll dump Emery at the end of the season.

Anyway any manager would be sensible to learn other languages just in case especially if you want the highest paying jobs.

Mourinho is apparently learning German currently just in case an opportunity comes around.
 

jsp

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He is what we need
I dunno I think he's a guy who's happy taking over a steady ship he's not the sort of guy who will rebuild something.

I don't know a huge amount about his career but he basically squeezed the last few drops out of an old Milan team before they cashed in all the players then took over the best team in the league and continued to dominate.

If you've got all the pieces available he can solve the puzzle but Utd isn't that at the moment Utd is a puzzle that's missing the box and half the pieces and the manager is expected to come up with a solution to complete it.
 

TheChosenJuan

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I dunno I think he's a guy who's happy taking over a steady ship he's not the sort of guy who will rebuild something.

I don't know a huge amount about his career but he basically squeezed the last few drops out of an old Milan team before they cashed in all the players then took over the best team in the league and continued to dominate.

If you've got all the pieces available he can solve the puzzle but Utd isn't that at the moment Utd is a puzzle that's missing the box and half the pieces and the manager is expected to come up with a solution to complete it.
Not the type to rebuild? He rebuilt Juventus completely. Look at the squad when he took over compared to when he left. The only constant was the BBBC and 2 of them are gone (Buffon no longer 1st choice, Bonucci and Chiellini's replacements already at the club while Sandro wasn't there when he joined either).
Look at the midfield - Pirlo,Pogba, Vidal and Marchisio to Pjanic, Khedira, Can, Ramsey.
Forwards- Tevez and Morata to Higuain, Dybala, Ronaldo and Mandzukic
Wingers- Bernardeschi, Costa, Cuadrado.

That's an entire squad practically replaced
 

jsp

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Not the type to rebuild? He rebuilt Juventus completely. Look at the squad when he took over compared to when he left. The only constant was the BBBC and 2 of them are gone (Buffon no longer 1st choice, Bonucci and Chiellini's replacements already at the club while Sandro wasn't there when he joined either).
Look at the midfield - Pirlo,Pogba, Vidal and Marchisio to Pjanic, Khedira, Can, Ramsey.
Forwards- Tevez and Morata to Higuain, Dybala, Ronaldo and Mandzukic
Wingers- Bernardeschi, Costa, Cuadrado.

That's an entire squad practically replaced
Did he do that or did the club do that?

Juventus have sporting directors who call the shots in terms of the playing staff it's a well oiled machine that has reaped the rewards of being the top dog in Italy and being able to bully it's rivals who've all been financially weak for the last decade.

My point is when he arrived he arrived he took over the best team and at all times when he was there he had the best team and the club also were able to pick off other teams top players the double wammy of strengthen yourself and weaken a rival.

Coming into Utd he would be taking over the 6th best squad in the league and I don't think he's a manager who sees himself as a talent spotter he just gets the best out of what he's given and in the case of Juventus he was given a lot of quality to work with which allowed him to deliver great results.

I think at Utd he'd give us a well coached and well drilled team but like all managers he'd need someone helping him with transfers because to make any real difference he will need better quality players and Utd have struggled with recruitment for the last decade really even the later years of Fergie wasn't perfect. I'd say he probably had more misses than hits in the last few years of his career because the club refused to spend top money on players remember the "no value in the market" years.
 

TheChosenJuan

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Did he do that or did the club do that?

Juventus have sporting directors who call the shots in terms of the playing staff it's a well oiled machine that has reaped the rewards of being the top dog in Italy and being able to bully it's rivals who've all been financially weak for the last decade.

My point is when he arrived he arrived he took over the best team and at all times when he was there he had the best team and the club also were able to pick off other teams top players the double wammy of strengthen yourself and weaken a rival.

Coming into Utd he would be taking over the 6th best squad in the league and I don't think he's a manager who sees himself as a talent spotter he just gets the best out of what he's given and in the case of Juventus he was given a lot of quality to work with which allowed him to deliver great results.

I think at Utd he'd give us a well coached and well drilled team but like all managers he'd need someone helping him with transfers because to make any real difference he will need better quality players and Utd have struggled with recruitment for the last decade really even the later years of Fergie wasn't perfect. I'd say he probably had more misses than hits in the last few years of his career because the club refused to spend top money on players remember the "no value in the market" years.
I agree with that and trace our decline back to June 2009 when Ronaldo was sold and Tevez allowed to leave without being replaced. Glazerpologists will say money was available (because SAF said so yet these lot insist Ole was fuming with the board despite saying the opposite).
There was apparently £25m set aside for Tevez independent of the CR7 sale. No value in the market? The club who purchased CR7(€94m) sold Robben and Sneijder for a combined €40m to Bayern (LVG)and Inter(Mourinho)respectively.
All we signed that summer was Obertan, Valencia + Owen for a combined £20m. Not even the money for Tevez was spent despite 2 absolute quality players we could have gotten in the Ronaldo deal along with £50m. With that £50m you could have bought Yaya (£24m is what City paid in 2010) and David Silva (£26m on the back of a World Cup that saw him emerge with a winner's medal). Or forget Silva, you could have bought Smalling and Valencia.
So we could have signed for that money (and arguement's sake) : Yaya, Smalling, Robben, Sneijder and Valencia without dipping into the Tevez funds.
You know who scored the goal that knocked us out of the Champions League that season? Robben.
Who set up the opener in the Champions League Final against Robben's team? Sneijder. We paid more for Jones and Young than it would have cost to purchase those 2.
Imagine a midfield of Yaya, Carrick and Sneijder with a front 3 of Robben, Rooney and Nani.
Bench: Giggs, Scholes, Valencia, Smalling, Fletcher, Berbatov.
No value in the market? The following summer saw the following transfers happen after these players all had strong world cups:
Real Madrid under Jose:
Ozil and Khedira (combined £25m)
Di Maria (£20m)
You telling me no value in the market?
 

jsp

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Mate come on now... It's not even the 6th best let's be real.
Based on the league table last year it is and when everyone is fit it probably is..... just!

Although you could easily argue it’s weaker this season that last season which would be fair but from memory there was a decent gap between 6th and 7th last season
 

RichH2016

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Based on the league table last year it is and when everyone is fit it probably is..... just!

Although you could easily argue it’s weaker this season that last season which would be fair but from memory there was a decent gap between 6th and 7th last season
It's definitely weaker than last year by quite some margin.
 

jsp

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It's definitely weaker than last year by quite some margin.
I dunno like I said when everyone is fit

AWB massive upgrade on Young
Maguire upgrade on Smalling
James upgrade on Sanchez (the one who we saw not the one we saw at Arsenal)

McTominay I think has done a good job replacing Herrera probably not as good but improving all the time.

Lukaku not being replaced is a problem

The decline of senior players in like Young, Matic, Mata hasn’t been balanced by improvement in younger players like Shaw, Periera, Rashford which has been a problem.

My point really is I felt the squad was good enough to see Utd stand still in the league and finish 6th with a good run it could get 4th with a bad run it could drop to 8th. It’s obviously gone bad because we are a thin squad injuries catch up to us quickly fingers crossed after internationals that will ease a bit and things might improve.

I think a manager like Allegri would get more out of it he’d certainly make it better coached but I don’t think it would be pretty as he doesn’t have the players to play a controlling style of football. Utd with these players need to be a team that keeps it low scoring and is clinical in the vital moments to win games which is kind of what isn’t happening big chances are being missed by us but taken by the opposition.
 

RichH2016

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My point really is I felt the squad was good enough to see Utd stand still in the league and finish 6th with a good run it could get 4th with a bad run it could drop to 8th
I've said since the summer this team would struggle to make top 6 and I stand by that.

AWB is an upgrade but ultimately a RB isn't going to make a world of difference.

Losing so many midfielders, especially Herrera, and not replacing them was ridiculous. And letting both Sanchez and Lukaku go without replacing them was equally as bad.

Add to that ageing players as you point out that just weren't good enough last year and are now a year older and this team really is significantly worse.
 

TheChosenJuan

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I've said since the summer this team would struggle to make top 6 and I stand by that.

AWB is an upgrade but ultimately a RB isn't going to make a world of difference.

Losing so many midfielders, especially Herrera, and not replacing them was ridiculous. And letting both Sanchez and Lukaku go without replacing them was equally as bad.

Add to that ageing players as you point out that just weren't good enough last year and are now a year older and this team really is significantly worse.
Should have put Dalot at RB to let him develop with Darmiam as back up. Rojo and Williams should have been Luke Shaw's back up. Tuanzebe, Maguire, Lindelof and Smalling would have been sufficient for CB. I would have sold Young and kept Darmian if given the choice. If I knew Jones or Bailly would return quicker, sell Young and Darmian, 1 of those 2 as CB cover and Smalling for RB cover. That £50m+ should have been used to plug holes in the team such as Mandzukic, Carrasco and Bruno Fernandes.
None of the problems you see today would be present if Wan Bissaka, a defensive RB was replaced with Dalot, some of the deadwood sold/released (Bailly or Jones rather than Smalling + Young + Mata + Darmian). You can then ease in the likes of Greenwood, Garner, Gomes and Chong while Fred in the right system may have shown better form.
 

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Dalot spent the first two months of this season injured. We’ve signed what looks like a generational right back. One that doesn’t come around often and will be there for the next 8-10 years. I think AWB was a fantastic signing. Young isn’t good enough and Dalot has showed no evidence of being able to stay fit. I would give Dalot games in front of AWB though as he’s a fantastic crosser of the ball and our RW options aren’t great.
 

jsp

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Dalot missed most of last season with injury and he's missed quite a few games already with injury the lad looks nowhere near ready physically for this level of football after 70 minutes in games he's already looking gassed and struggling to run. From the day he arrived he never looked ready and I think he was a stupid but they should have left him at Porto or signed him and immediately loaned him out somewhere as he needed to play regular football.

The signing of AWB for me was a no brainer Valencia left on a free, Darmian sold, Young way to old Utd had to sign a new player and AWB was arguably the best RB in the league last season probably just behind Alexander-Arnold.
 

TheChosenJuan

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Dalot spent the first two months of this season injured. We’ve signed what looks like a generational right back. One that doesn’t come around often and will be there for the next 8-10 years. I think AWB was a fantastic signing. Young isn’t good enough and Dalot has showed no evidence of being able to stay fit. I would give Dalot games in front of AWB though as he’s a fantastic crosser of the ball and our RW options aren’t great.
Great idea
 

jsp

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Who exactly are we crossing the ball to lads?

When was the last time Rashford or Martial scored a header?
 

Mr C

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Rashford is never in the right place. He can only score goals like last night for England.

One negative thing about Ole, I thought he would have improved Rashford in this thinking.
 

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Dalot hasn’t shown anything to suggest he should be playing right wing for us. He puts in the odd good cross but other than that nothing. Might as well just keep Pereira out there who can also put in a good cross but looks to have more about him as an overall player.
 

IDFD

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I don’t think Periera has anything about him as a player tbh.

Pogba should be breaking in to the box late to arrive on the end of crosses and Dalot is the best crosser of the ball in our squad.

Also if Martial and Rashford can’t head a ball neither should be playing up top. Remember when Ronaldo couldn’t head a ball? There’s no excuse for being poor at it except a lack of practise. Neither are short.
 

Mr C

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Pereira is a terrible player, the fact he starts says it all about our squad.

I'm hoping Pogba and Martial will be fit for the next phase of games.

I mentioned pre season I would play Dalot in front of Wan Bissaka, and I still think he's our best option there. He's good going forward.
 

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