Labour's New Leader

Shoot

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
684
A nice enough fella on the face of things and definitely well learned.
How'ever he has a big flaw.....
He refused to accept the results of the Brexit referendum, demanding a second referendum and therefore refusing to accept the democratic process. In fact, some of his Labour colleagues cited this as the reason why they so emphatically lost the last election.
It's also the reason he will never get my vote.
 

O-Dog

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
756
Location
Cloud cuckoo land
I'll vote for him if he has the right policies.

He was right to challenge Brexit. I admire him for that.
 

jsp

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2012
Messages
11,067
They lost the election because Corbyn just isn’t a guy you look at and see leadership he might have been saying all the right things but he was to easy a target for the media to take down.

Starmer won’t have much choice with brexit that will be a thing of the past when it comes to running for PM next time around he should be able to pick the tories apart over the next few years expose them to the public.

Post coronavirus it should be easy pickings for the Labour Party as the tories made a complete mess of this thing early on
 

IDFD

Moderator
Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
5,071
Age
33
The reason for Brexit being a major issue was because the party didn’t have a clear decision made. Corbyn sat on the fence as he’s always been pro Brexit and the party wanted to remain. It meant labour weren't seen as a leave or remain party. It was a shocking bit of mismanagement from Corbyn who needed to take a side and go with it.

I like the fact Starmer isn’t a career politician. Only retired 3 years ago. But a lot more to see from him yet.
 

jsp

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2012
Messages
11,067
Yeah it was a real problem for them they probably needed to go remain just to be against the tories and hope that they could unite the remain vote but they knew that would hurt them long term as a party. The tories has it easy they scooped up the leave voters in their droves and they knew the Tory retainers would stick with them as they had nowhere else to go.

The position they took was actually created by Starmer though so not really a good start for him.
 

Shoot

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
684
So, he appoints Angela Rayner as his deputy!
A strange bag that. Leaves school at 16 up the duff with no qualifications and a hard line trade unionist?
 

O-Dog

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
756
Location
Cloud cuckoo land
Leaves school at 16 up the duff with no qualifications and a hard line trade unionist?
Wow, you're a compassionate soul.

It's not when or how you leave school that counts, but what you do with the rest of your life.

She views herself as on the soft left of the party, so fairly mainstream.

I bet all the poor sods in the gig economy would be grateful of some effective representation. Perhaps they could form a union or something.

Still, having thousands of working poor with no entitlement to sick pay or paid leave or guaranteed hours is a small price to pay to rid ourselves of the evils of unions. After all, if the shit hits the fan, the state can bail them out. No need to trouble the wealthy corporations.
 

IDFD

Moderator
Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
5,071
Age
33
When I saw the judgement of her having a child and leaving school I thought best to ignore it.

She can’t be a good politician she didn’t go to Harrow. It’s that attitude from the conservatives that anger people. Compassion is always sorely lacking. She’s in her 40’s but you want to judge her on something that happened over half her life ago.

My mum had me at 15. We were homeless lived at Waterloo station. She’s now a school teacher. Having a child young and leaving school doesn’t make you a failure for the rest of your life.
 

Shoot

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
684
Wow, you're a compassionate soul.



I bet all the poor sods in the gig economy would be grateful of some effective representation. Perhaps they could form a union or something.

Still, having thousands of working poor with no entitlement to sick pay or paid leave or guaranteed hours is a small price to pay to rid ourselves of the evils of unions. After all, if the shit hits the fan, the state can bail them out. No need to trouble the wealthy corporations.
I am 1 of those and presently have little or no support offered from the Government.
 

Shoot

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
684
When I saw the judgement of her having a child and leaving school I thought best to ignore it.

She can’t be a good politician she didn’t go to Harrow. It’s that attitude from the conservatives that anger people. Compassion is always sorely lacking. She’s in her 40’s but you want to judge her on something that happened over half her life ago.

My mum had me at 15. We were homeless lived at Waterloo station. She’s now a school teacher. Having a child young and leaving school doesn’t make you a failure for the rest of your life.
I don't know why you should ignore it. You need to understand that I didn't make any judgement. I simply made the statement that laid the foundation for you to offer your own views on the matter.
 

IDFD

Moderator
Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
5,071
Age
33
I would agree with you if your statement wasn't following this one 'A strange bag that....'

So you did make a judgement stop with this false narrative you try and create in your arguments. It's tiresome and childish.

And I don't see any negative impact of her having a child at 15 and going on to have a highly successful life still. Only positives, it probably means she can relate to most in this country a lot better than most politicians. So I wouldn't ignore it. However I think you probably relate to it with negative connotations hence your strange bag comments.
 

Shoot

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
684
Well put it this way, if this Labour set up was in power and Starmer had to take leave, she would be running the country.
That tells me that Labour are in fact now weeker than they were before Starmer took charge.
No false narrative at all. And I am not having an argument.
 

O-Dog

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
756
Location
Cloud cuckoo land
Well put it this way, if this Labour set up was in power and Starmer had to take leave, she would be running the country.
Not correct. The Labour deputy leader's role when its leader is absent is to manage the election of the new leader, not assume the lead.

If Labour were in power, the interim PM would be a cabinet choice, same as it is for the Tories.

For example, Harriet Harmen, who was deputy leader of the Labour party when Gordon Brown took power, was not then appointed deputy PM.
 

Shoot

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
684
Not correct. The Labour deputy leader's role when its leader is absent is to manage the election of the new leader, not assume the lead.

If Labour were in power, the interim PM would be a cabinet choice, same as it is for the Tories.

For example, Harriet Harmen, who was deputy leader of the Labour party when Gordon Brown took power, was not then appointed deputy PM.
I'm not sure your right on that one, do you have a source of confirmation? where have you got that from?
You appear to be suggesting that Starmer has appointed a Deputy PM to oversee the appointment of another Deputy PM should he be absent.
A Deputy PM is defined as follows:
A government minister who can take the position of acting prime minister when the prime minister is temporarily absent.

Boris Johnson did not appoint a Deputy PM, however as First Secretary of State Dominic Raab was appointed to deputise in his absence solely by Boris, not elected or chosen by the cabinet, that is evident in the fact that Raab is actually an unpopular choice within the Tory party.
 

O-Dog

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
756
Location
Cloud cuckoo land
The deputy leader of the Labour party is elected by Labour members and officials, not appointed by the leader of the party.

There is no constitutional link between being deputy leader of the Labour party and Deputy PM.

Starmer is free to choose his deputy PM. Another example, Brown, when chancellor, was the de facto deputy PM but he was not deputy leader of the Labour party.

Deputy leader of the Labour party is a party official. The deputy PM is a government official. The party and the government are not the same thing, as both May and Johnson found out.
 

Shoot

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
684
Ah....... I been getting confused with Deputy Leader and Deputy PM.
However the role of First Secretary of State is usually considered the "de facto Deputy PM" and therefore Raab was effectively appointed as such by Boris.
In regards to the Labour situation, you were right and I was wrong. Thank god for that.
 

Rammlied

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 24, 2020
Messages
201
Age
33
Location
Suecia
I vote Capitalism in 2006.

I didn't vote in 2010.

I vote Social Democrats in 2014.

I vote Swedish Democrats in 2018.

Then I vote in the EU election in 2019 but prefer not say the party.
 

Login or Register

Forgot your password?
Don't have an account? Register now
Top